According to a report from Paul Sullivan of the Tribune, Ted Lilly "underwent left shoulder arthroscopy and debridement on Tuesday". The Cubs announced Lilly had the surgery on Wednesday and said the southpaw "will be ready to return sometime in April."
The surgery was performed by Dr. Lewis Yocum. "Lilly said at the end of the season he didn't expect to have anything done, but obviously felt pain in the shoulder and had a procedure done."
According to the report on Cubs.com, Dr. Yocum "found no major damage to Lilly's shoulder and the procedure consisted of a washout and clean up of the shoulder. The procedure took approximately one hour to complete."
With Ted Lilly out until "sometime in April" the Cubs must find another frontline starter to take his place ... if they want to contend in 2010.
Stay Tuned ...
Subscribe
A lot of surgeries have been announced this wee for some MLB players.
Uhhh yeah... Let's Give him an extension! Great Work Jimmy! Think with your dipstick....
This is not a good start to the offseason.
Lilly will be fine.
I would extend him in a heartbeat.
To me, he's the type of guy you want on your team. How many good, consistent left handed starters like him are out there ? Plus, he has great attitude, a real team guy.
And yes, he's getting older, but jeez, he's not a power pitcher. His type can pitch effectively well into his late 30's. There have been plenty of examples. He will be 34, that's not that old.
There's a reason the cubs starting pitching has been the strength of this team for 3 years now, and Lilly is a big factor in that.
Extend him, Jimbo !!!
I have to wonder if this changes priorities at all re the rotation.
We're counting on Well's to be the same ...if not better...a few season's ago...we thought the same of Hill...that just opted to become a rehabbing Free Agent.
I expect Lilly to bounce back...and the cheap answer is to resign Heilman and let him compete for the starting rotation....to begin with....
But I would feel a lot better if we did get another starter...or imported more
arms at the High AA/AAA level.
Shark clearly is not ready yet...and may never be.
Does anyone have the time to research
starting pitching staff opportunities?
Re extensions...it's premature just now.
See how this market shakes out.
Re Milton Bradley et al to the Braves
for Lowe...it's not going to happen.
Cox would not have the inclination or time to babysit Bradley.
While I've always loved Lowe...he's clearly on the downside and owed 45 million over the next 3 years...too much
when we have to create payroll flexibility for a youth movement.
Not to mention...the Braves would want a lot of young pitching included.
Lowe is a nice dream...but like Peavy
before...would cost too much.
thats what im worried about with wells...
I do not think Wells will be better because he is contact pitcher, he do not have an out pitch. Gorzelanny is very inconsistent. Remember Lily had knee problems that should raise a red flag. Carlos Zambrano is not an ace what have done for us lately.Suzy Heilman being on the team is not a good idea.
Free Agents Starters
John Lacky-he cost too much money.
Jason Marquis was a bust in a Cubs uniform.
Kelvim Escobar is always injured.
Rich Harden-offer him arbitration.
We can trade for a good starter because we are trying to rebuild our farm system , however, if it was not for Jim Hendry horrible trades except for Rich Harden and John Grabow we would not be in so much chaos.
Wells significantly outperformed his expectations this year. I'm not sure what his BABIP was, but I'm guessing he was on the lucky side. We should expect regression and poorer stats from Wells in 2010.
David teams hit .261 against Wells in 2009, his BABIP was .292.
WE NEED TO SIGN/TRADE FOR A 1-2 TYPE STARTER!!!!!!!!!!
Ted Lilly will be coming off of injury and will still be likely our most consistent pitcher...
Randy Wells is still a question mark in my mind, who knows if he was a flash in the pan (Liriano, Carmona, Rich Hill...dime a dozen)
Dempster is a solid number 3 pitcher and really came on strong as the season progressed (still wont scare opposing lineups)
Gorzelanny is a number 5 on an average team...had a solid year a few years ago, looked decent at times, Im not comfortable with him taking the mound every 5th day
Zambrano is amazing when hes on...but when is he on!? He has faltered in the second half now for 3 straight seasons and has also had some injuries...
Samardzija looked really bad in any capacity last year (rp/sp) and i have no faith in him.
All in all, pitching depth is key to success and last year we saw ours disappear in a hurry... its safe to assume that at least 1-2 or more of our starters will see DL time and we need to be able to combat taht.
I know Lowe may be a longshot but if they could figure out a way to get Lowe, Vazquez, Lackey, Wolf or somebody...they better do it
Why would you say that he (Wells) was "lucky"? The kid showed wonderful maturity and poise, and pitched the right way....he threw strikes and regularly got ahead on the count early.
I personally think he'll continue to develop from experience and show even better results.
We need more individuals like Wells who are honored to have a spot on a major league roster, and are committed to working hard v. the prima donas like Zambrano who get "fat and lazy" with their big contracts.
Excellent point Bryan.
A few other thoughts:
Better defense will make our pitching staff that much better...especially
wth contact and groundball pitchers...that really are the best type suited to Wrigley.
To Ronald...I disagree Marquis was a bust with us...he was an excellent bottom of the rotation guy.
Over 2 years he was 23-18 and ate up 357.2 innings....Most teams would drool over that for a fifth starter.
Given Hendry's history...and budgetary constraints...watch for him to pick up some rehabbing starters cheap for a AAA
look-see.
I was wrong about the BABIP ... Wells is close to the league average so he had average luck on balls in play.
That said, look at Wells' minor league stats at AAA for '06, '07 and '08. He was 25 years old in 2008. I don't think those stats at those ages at AAA project into sustained major league performance like 2009 Wells. Can pitchers like that have a good year here and there? ... yes, quite often. Can they sustain that performance? ... rarely. So, it's possible that Wells will meet or exceed his 2009 stats in 2010, but I don't see statistical support for it. What am I missing? I'd like to be convinced I'm wrong.
i don't know, David. To rag on Wells because he wasn't a hyped prospect is not good way to look at it. And I agree with Suzy, there is nothing wrong with pitching to contact. Frankly, I feel like too many young pitchers are afraid to pitch to contact which leads to over-throwing which leads to injuries. More often it is a mature pitcher with experience that confidently pitches to contact. Wells proved his maturity by staying positive and making adjustments throughout tough losses and bad performances. And finally, I do not think he needs to "earn" his spot this spring, competition is always good, but if he didn't earn it last year, being the most consistent starter on the staff then I don't know what would.
One more thought on being 25 and not necessarily turning heads: Chase Utley was an unknown 2Bman at the age of 25 when the Phillies gave him a chance to play. Some guys make their careers with work and dedication, the "pedigree" can be over rated. Derek Jeter?
SuzyS,
I totally agree with you on Marquis ... he was worth the 3 year, $21 mil deal he signed with the Cubs. Other than Ted Lilly who was a great signing, Marquis was one of the better (for the money paid) starting pitcher free agent signings that season.
Enough of the Andy Petite closeups.
I think that I can count his whiskers.
First I support those who were in favor of Marquis. He was a GREAT number 5 and did what he was here to do--eat innings. He was a good value as well. Also, face it...he STILL has the streak of never missing the playoffs. I'd bring him back, but he's a type B so it would cost us a pick. Not sure I'd do that.
Not really a time to panic at this point. Keep in mind for the first part of April we usually run a 4-man rotation anyhow because of the scheduled off days.
Also, as far as pitching maybe this gives the Cubs a bigger push for Harden. If he accepts something reasonable I dont see how we don't bring him back. Then this would give Gorzelanny a chance to step in for a couple starts in April.
If we don't resign Harden....I looked over the list of free agents and many carry a Type A or Type B attachment. For those that don't I saw a couple who might be worth a chance.
Todd Wellemeyer. Struggled a bit this year but last year was pretty good for the Red Birds. Might be worth a look and wouldnt be too expensive. At 30 still young enough
Jarrod Washburn. Would be another lefty. Struggled when he was shipped over to Detroit at the end of the year...but did really well in Seattle up to that point. Might want to much money and too many years as this is probably his last money-contract at 34.
Of course in house we have Heilman who seems more comfortable starting and has always said thats what he wants to do. They could turn to him and see what he can do.
What we REALLY need is Zambrano to be working his ass off to be in the best shape ever and ready to be an ace. We need Dempster to be more like 2008 than 2009.
I do have a question.....what is with the medical staff for the Cubs? Was Lilly hiding pain? Did this just suddenly come up? Would have been nice to have gotten it taken care of a few weeks ago. But, Lilly is a gamer.....her will rehab as fast and strong as he can.
Joe, You're right...what we really need is Zambrano to BE an Ace.
And Soriano being the Soriano we signed...or close to it.
But we cannot count on either.
Thanks for the work checking on pitchers.
I did too...and no one jumped out at me.
Think cheap...JH likes longshots on the cheap...like Sheets or Prior or somesuch
that has a possible upside and little investment.
-and before you jump up and down...I'm only using Prior as an example.
I'm on radio tonight Jim...whiska's
don't count there thank God.
I have to gibe a grudging respect to
Pettite...he's like the energizer bunny...just keeps going...I can remember him in the 1996 WS as a tough
warrior....flash forward 13 years later
and he's still a warrior in the WS...with the same team.
Wish Woody or Prior could have done that.
Yeah...would have been nice....thanks Dusty!! (Baker)
Jeez even though the baseball season just ended a couple of hours ago, I'm already missing it. I didn't follow the World Series too much but did catch some of it, mainly I just can't wait for Spring Training. I just want to see what JH can do to try and fix the mess from last year. Maybe it's just because I'm blinded by optimism but I feel like this team will come back next season much more prepared after being humbled like they were. I'm just getting so sick and tired of seeing all these other teams be able to celebrate while we gotta be talking about the offseason, mark my words, come this time(or late October since there won't be a WBC) the offseason will be the last thing us as Cubs fans will be talking about. And if I'm wrong I'll take my crow without salt
I would love to see Hendry spend money on pitching and fix the other spots thru the trade route. I think we should dabble in the Cliff Lee sweepstakes. He is playoff proven!! He is a bonafide ace, knock Zambrano to 2nd slot then Lilly then Demp then Wells. The guy has proven he can beat the Yankees and the Dodgers. He can pitch on threes day rest when it gets time to do so.
Spend every dime allotted for payroll increase on Lee, then trade Bradley, Hoffpauir, Fox, whomever to fill the CF/RF hole and get some decent backups or give the kids a shot as backups.
And as soon as I posted that, I went back and read that the Phillies are talking extension with Cliff Lee. They hold an option on him for like 8 million. What a steal!!!
Woody, That's what happens when you have a deep farm system...The Phillies gave up some great prospects to get Lee.
The extension is going to cost them
but still...a good deal for them.
It just goes to show you that once you make the playoffs, about anything can happen. Announcers, and so-called "experts" love to tout "pitching and defense wins championships", but the Yankees didn't really have any stand-outs in their rotation this year aside from CC Sabathia. Here's the stat lines:
Sabathia-19-8, 3.37 ERA
Burnett-13-9, 4.04 ERA
Pettitte-14-8, 4.16 ERA
Chamberlain-9-6, 4.75 ERA
Thing is, they weren't that great in their rotation going into the playoffs, but they had 9 guys in double figures with home runs and 7 guys with 80+ RBI...True, they only committed 86 errors, but the proof is in their offense. The proof is also in the Phillies offense as to why they reached the playoffs, and then the World Series.
Just FYI, the Cubs had the following:
Zambrano-9-7, 3.77 ERA
Dempster-11-9, 3.64 ERA
Lilly-12-9, 3.10 ERA
Wells-12-10, 3.05 ERA
Harden-9-9, 4.09 ERA
Clearly, if the Cubs made the playoffs, if they had any semblance of an offense, you'd have to like their chances. But the Cubs had 8 guys with double figures in home runs (only 2 above 20 hr), and just one player with even 65+ RBI, and combine that with their 105 errors, and you begin to see just how awful the Cubs were this year outside of their pitching (and also their horrible closer-Gregg)...but it's quite clear that teams that don't hit in the postseason, don't win, no matter how great their starting rotation supposedly is.
The Cubs had one of the best rotations in all of baseball this year, they just couldn't hit their way out of a paper bag, and all too often, we saw the starting pitchers supply most of the offense on days we didn't hit, which made it even more painful to watch.
...also, to reinforce my points, the Phillies had 6 players with over 75+RBI, and 7 players with double digit home runs (and 5 with 20+hr). They also had just 76 errors. Here's the weird thing though....they had almost even starting pitching, but 2 of their starters had sub 4 ERA's (Happ, Lee...3 if you include Pedro replacing Moyer at the end of the year) compared to the Yankees just one under 4. (Sabathia...I guess you could say 2 if you include Gaudin's 6 starts) The ironic thing is the Phillies didn't even start Happ, and it's quite clear they should have...but I digress.
I've discussed this ad nauseam in the past folks...I'm NOT disregarding the importance of a strong pitching staff, but it's quite clear that a strong lineup trumps a strong pitching staff late in the postseason. You can have 4 guys in your rotation with 4+ ERA's as long as you have a prolific lineup. To me, that's FAR easier to get than consistent pitching. We only really can trust that Zambrano will get a sub 4 ERA, and that's it. For hitting, we can only trust that when healthy, ARAM will get 20-30 hr, and 100+RBI, and Lee will hit 20+ hr, 80+RBI, but in reality, that's all we have to count on offensively, and it's NOT a recipe for success.
I just showed you how you almost certainly need 5 or more players with 70+RBI.
In my opinion, possibilities might be: Dunn, Burrell, Uggla. Unfortunately, there aren't any other options like that out there.
Basically Bradley is swapped for Burrell, which makes our defense even worse. So, the hope would be to flip him, and pray that Soriano can give you what Burrell would've, and we'd need two more sources of RBI, and that'd come from Dunn and Uggla.
So...how about:
Castro-SS
Uggla-2B (30+hr, 90+RBI avg)
Lee-1B (20+hr, 80+RBI avg)
ARAM-3B (25+hr, 100+RBI avg)
Dunn-RF (40+hr, 100+RBI avg)
Soriano-LF (prior to Cubs, about 30+hr, 90+RBI)
Soto-C
Cameron/Fuld/Colvin-CF
For both Uggla and Dunn, you'd have to get really creative to get them and still keep your top prospects. I'm thinking a combination of: Fox, Hoffpauir, Theriot, Fontenot, Fuld, Marshall, Stevens, Atkins, Jay Jackson, Coleman, Barney, Colvin, Clevenger, Mateo, Parker, Gaub, might be traded to land some bats. If it got you CONSISTENT performers like Uggla and Dunn, then I'd do it in a heartbeat, but at this point, there's no way I'm trading Cashner, Castro, Vitters, Burke, and Flaherty.
It'll be a very interesting offseason...
Aaron, How are we going to afford Dunn AND Uggla...Where did Fukodome and his 26 mil go?
And if great offense trumps great pitching...how do you account for Cliff Lee?
Overall no argument re the great Offense of the Yankees....But the Yankees have not won the World Series since 2000...
and had a great offense every year.
You need both to win...not one over the other.
Give me Sabathia/Lee/Lackey/Halladay/and
Let's say Carpenter (Just for local flavor...and a bullpen to mirror that
and an average offense....and that team wins hands down....No matter what offense you put out there.
Suzy,
Obviously I wasn't saying that overall because you still have to show up and pitch decent to win, but what we saw throughout the entire playoffs was that good hitting put teams over the top, particularly power hitters. If you notice, most of the "speed" type of guys didn't even make a difference. Pierre, Furcal, Figgins, EY Jr., Ellsbury, etc. didn't even make one bit of difference. It was guys like Kemp, Howard, Utley, Ibanez, Werth, AROD, Matsui, Teixeira (earlier rounds), etc. that made all the difference. It was also smart baserunning that made a difference, and we saw that firsthand with Pujols this year and how he won a game against us with smart baserunning, and how AROD did the same with the Yankees in the WS.
I honestly don't have an answer for Fukudome, just as I don't have a true answer for Bradley...or even Soriano for that matter. All 3 suck so badly, they make our team look horrendous. When virtually all you had last year was the Derrek Lee and Jake Fox show, it became REALLY ugly to watch. IMO, you absolutely have to get rid of all 3 to have a legitimate contender, and I just don't see that happening. I still like the idea of a Soriano-Wells swap, simply because Wells puts a lot more balls in play than Soriano with Soriano's ugly strikeouts. I like a Bradley-Burrell swap, then flipping Burrell to another team, possibly the Rangers for a prospect like Moreland, and then going after Dunn and Ugla. I like finding any taker whatsoever for Fukudome. He adds virtually nothing to this team, and I'm not exaggerating. His $12 million/yr salary is a hinderance, and he keeps getting worse at the plate. I don't know what you do with him, other than eat 50% of his remaining salary just to free up a roster spot.
Re: pitching in the WS....the Yankees pen, outside of Rivera was pretty awful during the playoffs and WS. As I said, once you get to the playoffs, almost anything can happen, but it sure goes to show that good hitting can trump a poor effort from the pen or rotation
No disagreements with Soriano/Fukodome/Bradley...The worst outfield I can recall the Cubs having...in that there was not one bright spot.
Wells for Soriano...I'd do in a heartbeat...but Toronto would have to
give up some prospects in lieu of the financial savings they would get.
I'll accept Dunn...IF...Soriano is gone.
The reality is we won't get rid of our "Ugly Three" all at once.
Looks like Bradley this offseason...Perhaps Fukodome (if he does anyting) at the summer trading deadline
or next offseason)...When it's less money for both teams to absorb.
And Soriano...whenever...If I'm the Cubs
I'm constantly shopping him from now on.
I really don't see a lot happening until
we start solidifying the outfield with
a new young crop of SLUGGERS and defenders.
OFFENSE OFFENSE OFFENSE!!!
The Cubs pitching has been above average for a number of years now, but barring 2008, the offense has STUNK!!! By that, I mean GARBAGE!!! Complete, utter, thorough, Garbage. That kind of offense will never win a WS in 10,000 years.