This is a good (though not great trade). Grabow will help us this year. While the odds are that none of Gorz, Hart or Ascanio will develop into above average major leaguers, Gorz has the most upside of the 3 by a wide margin. Solid deal.

Amen, Neil. Well said.

Hart has 18 BB and 13 SO this year and a career of 40 BB and 49 SO, 1.68 WHIP in 66 innings of major league experience.

Gorz has 383 innings and a 1.5 WHIP. I'll take Gorz and his experience.

I don't like losing Ascanio but Grabow, once again, is experienced.

I live in Denver and the Denver press loves this trade for the Cubs. Can't wait for the games next weekend. Wrigley Field West and with the Rockies playing well, it should be a heck of a series.

A few things to think about. With Hart bei ng the guy that has been filling in do they really bring in Marshall or does Hendry have another trade for an SP in the works also? I liked what Hart has done lately but I think Hendry saw a chance to get max value for him and sent him packing. Only time will tell on this but I think the likely option is that it is a nothing trade.

Good to hear from you Tom...

Generally Stevens doesn't walk anybody, and he gets outs.

Hey, if someone throws strikes, he's very valuable in a bullpen that can't throw strike one (eg. Heilman, Marmol, Gregg).

Stevens' value may be that he contrasts well with the hard throwers in the pen. He gets into the 90's but his curve ball makes him a different look from the right side.

Why is everyone in love with Jeff Stevens after 3 games? I admit, so far so good, and I hope he keeps it up but there is nothing really special about the way he pitches.

ok they got 2

ohh man I hate the Dodgers...can't they hit with men on??????

This trade is a need trade nothing more, nothing less. Hart was a fill in for a banged up team and if Ascanio is so damn good he should be a solid 25 man roster citizen, he wasn't and far from HOF material. The only way JH impresses all of you closet GMs is to dump the crappy players we don't want i.e. Miles, Heilman, for a starting 2nd baseman? Please refer back to last year and show me a post that calls for an end to his run, we are in a virtual tie give or take for a divisional title AGAIN and have weathered a ton of injuries and solid players historically, having a bad year. Dallas Green, Larry Himes, Jim Frey, Ed Lynch thought they could do it and failed as did every GM since 1945 or 1908 if you want the WS ring. Let's hope the worst is behind us and we can peak into the post season. MAYBE all of that getting more left-handed manuevering WILL pay off!

Kevin Goldstein from Baseball Prospectus likes this trade for the Cubs.

Neil, what's your take after a little time to digest this?

I like the addition of Gorzelanny, I was hoping they would be able to add him to the mix for one reason, depth.

With the injury to Ted Lilly, the unknown that is Randy Wells, August approaching on Zambrano, Rich Harden's never-ending health concerns and Dempster coming off the DL, they needed to add depth at the Triple-A level. Other than Atkins, who has pitched better of late but has struggled for the most part this season, they have no one in Iowa they could pull up to help in case of injury. Samardzija needs more time.

I did not like what I saw from Kevin Hart in his first three outings and he has received a lot of run support. In a close game, it could get real ugly with him. But with that said, he gave them depth and a guy that could give them five innings in a pinch.

I think Ascanio could have a serviceable big league career. I am not as high on him as many around here are. I agree with Kevin Goldstein, he could be a good big league reliever one day but this season Jeff Stevens and Angel Guzman have done a better job.

As for Josh Harrison, I like what I have read about him but they have several 'Josh Harrisons' in Double-A or lower.

Only time will tell but losing the depth in the starting rotation options is the only reason I did not like the fact they dealt Hart.

It sounds like Gorzelanny will start on Tuesday, he is joining the team in Miami.

Aaron, This trade was made for THIS YEAR only. I have not seen Gorzelany pitch...but I'm hearing...(Dave Kaplan/WGN) that Gorzelanny had some injuries last year and actually has been pitching well at AAA this year...According to Kaplan and his guests, Gorzelanny is only at AAA because if he got enough service time...

(46 more days) he would become arbitration eligible. If Gorzelanny can

give us 6 consistant innings as a fifth

starter at 3 runs or less...then OK.

If he can't then the trade sucks. I don't care if a guy is finesse or high

powered...if he can get the out.

(Maddux/Wakefield/Moyer all survived a long time without power)Just get the out.

I honestly cannot give a verdict on this.

I know what we lost...I havn't seen what we gained.

Losing Hart/Ascainio...I thought it might happen...but I wish we expended them towards someone like EY Jr. instead...not just for this year...but for the future as well...But JH can't be concerned with that...Can He?

I wasn't sold on Hart...but Ascanio is

a differen

Good trade, most (outside of Chicago people) think the cubs won this trade.

Look, Harrison was never gonna be with the Cubs at best a bench guy.

Ascaino is good but the Cubs have this year next and if lucky the year after to win! At best with the Cubs hes a 7th inning guy, Guzman/marmol will be the closer while the other will be the set-up man.

hart is good but where does he play? After the season the Cubs will have 1 open spot in the rotation, it should be a FA/Shark/Marshall and now Gorzelanny.

The Cubs will get 2 picks at season end.

We basically traded Ascanio, Hart, Harrison for 1yr of Grabow and Gorzelanny as well as a 1st round pick and a sandwich pick.

Reports earlier said that Jay Jackson would go, Im relieved now.

just b/c a guy does good in a few starts doesnt make him a a player that will have a great career or even a decent career.

If Hart stayed with the Cubs this would of killed him: coming up then sent down, Up again, sent down again. This is been happening for 3 years.

Does anyone believe that Hendry feels as though the players he's traded for are suddenly going to become better?? Going from a small market team to a large market team is difficult and creates additional pressure on players to perform. These guys are going sink quickly, playing in front of 40K plus fans daily is not the same as 15K to 20K in Pittsburgh. The fasn will eats these guys alive, ask Bradley he'll tell you.

I'm not suggesting a Hall of Fame trade as some suggested about....yes, I dropped the dreaded "Brock for Broglio" in there. Why? Because Grabow is 30 years old, and sucks, and will probably be out of the game in 2 or 3 years like Broglio while Hart and Ascanio go onto have solid, above average MLB careers.

This move is pathetic, and all it was is Hendry making a move to make a move, just as he did a few years ago with Trachsel. Hart has already proven he can handle MLB hitters. Ascanio has also proven it. Gorzelanny couldn't hack it, and that's why he's in AAA right now, and Grabow has one good year on his resume at 30 years old----not exactly a fair trade is it? We got robbed blindly there.

EY Jr. is similar talent-wise to Harrison, only switch hits, and has slightly more upside. Both are fast, both have proven they can hit well in pro ball. Both are second basemen.

Hart vs Gorzelanny is NOT a wash. Just look at K totals and ERA at the big league level. Hart kills him there. Gorzelanny is nothing more than Sean Marshall but with less breaking stuff, so essentially we're getting a finesse lefty that, aside from 2 seasons in which he had high 3's ERA's, has been knocked around really good in the bigs. Unless you have impeccable control like a Glavine, Moyer (prior to this year), Hamels, etc., you're going to get knocked around, and Gorzelanny does NOT have good control.

While I understand Hart doesn't have the best control either...understand this....if you need a strikeout badly...who do you want? Hart or Gorzelanny....enough said. Furthermore, if you need one from the pen, who do you want. Ascanio or Grabow? Exactly! If you don't throw hard, and really more on deception or finesse than anything, they'll eventually figure you out, and you'll get pounded, unless you can paint the black. Anyway...just saying....I'd rather have a strikeout pitcher than a finesse pitcher anyday, because at the end of the day, pitchers are going to allow hits, walks, etc., and runners will be in scoring position with less than 2 outs. At that point, you'd like a guy that can get a strikeout, then induce a double play, or something to that effect. You do NOT want them to put it in play initially.

I tell you what. Just give it until the end of this year...not even "time", and you'll hate this deal. It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever on any level. We're fine with one lefty in the pen and Gaub, Waddell, and BJ Ryan at AAA (heck, even Papelbon if necessary). We didn't need to trade away an effective 5th starter, a quality, fast, lead-off type second baseman, AND a hard-throwing, closer-type in Ascanio.

Sorry, we got hosed...and I don't know how you Hendry apologists wake up everyday, and are like, "we have a very solid GM"....it's laughable how bad he is, and it just keeps getting worse....Like I said before, if we got Grabow, it'd be like a Trachsel trade, or a Karchner trade, and we'd end up getting hosed, and DRASTICALLY overpay.

I think you are really over reacting..Hart is not a top prospect he hasnt even been that lights out to this point...His start against cincy was all about the reds lineup being really bad with a bunch of free swingers! Once Hart faces a lineup with professional hitters who will take there walks he will get crushed! He has a good arm but throwing 94-95 doesnt mean much to major league hitters when you cannot locate it...Too often he gets hit hard! Gorzelanny is very comparable to Hart however i believe he was a steal! He also has much more EXPERIENCE then Hart...Everyone acts like Hart was gonna be in the rotation for the rest of the year...Ted "the bulldog" Lilly will return and our rotation will be fine! We needed another lefty in the bullpen and Grabow doesn't "suck" by any means, check his recent stats, plus Marshall will still be the first lefty called out of the pen, Grabow will not be required to do as much...And just look at it this way if he sucks we let him leave next year and recieve the prospects!! If he tears it up we have the option to try to resign him if we want...Grabow can do the job for the 60 or so games we have left...this isnt as big of a deal as we are making it to be...WE DID NOT GET RID OF ANY OF OUR TOP PROSPECTS!! One question what was gonna happen to Hart if he stayed with us for next year??? He sure as hell isnt taking anyone's spot in the rotation!

Actually, listening to Dave Kaplan...the jury is out on this one...we'll have to see...I like what I'm hearing about Gorzelanny...but the proof will be in the pudding.

Hendry suffers from moral panic. He feels he has to do something to counter-act the bone-head moves from earlier in the year...we all know what they were..Now he gives up young potential talent, which for some unknown reason always flurishes with other organizations for mediocre talent on the down side of their careers. Steve Stone for GM, complete the sale and hope upon hope that there is some stregic planning in the ranks that will make these past few trades make sense....

I'ts funny how our farm system ranks so low in MLB and gets criticized by ourselves saying it's gutted but yet we have the kids producing and kicking a$$ in the bigs. Either its good or not?

Note one [JH]might not be ranked high but his players say otherwise in the bigs for 3 straight years. From a farm that sucks so far we have showcased quite a few studs.

Marmol,Soto,Hoffpauir,Wells,K.Hill, S.Gallagher, Justin Berg,Atkins, Theriot,Guzman,Wuertz,Marshall,Fox,Fuld all performing. And by the way I'm not saying JH rocks but he needed a lefty reliever and got it PERIOD. The guy can't win a case here...if he trades he is bad if he doesn't he is on vacation? Dudes and Please give me a break with Hart already he did good just 3 games and now he is a CYoung? The guy was only allowed to pitch recently just to build up some value[and in fact he did] because he had none whatsoever and he sure had not earned his way to the big pitching.

Ascanio hurts but he was not pitching for us and he became the lefty we needed. Over all it was a good move specially if Gorezelanny can pitch better than Hart and he has done that.

If JH goes out there tonight and gets Roy Halladay people here will still be mad because he gave too much! Oh well I hope you all eat Crow and not me lol!

The same people who say our farm system is "worthless" are the same people who said Jake Fox is a "defensive butcher who will single-handedly lose games for you with his poor glove" and that Felix Pie was a "can't miss" prospect. There are some times where numbers are misleading a bit. But 9 times out of 10, it is very simple: numbers are the very essence of how good a player is. So if you have a guy hitting .300, it's best not to watch his baserunning and give him a negative because he has a twitch in his left leg while running from third to home or he nose starts to get a little stuffy before he attempts to steals a base. A lot of scouts are no better than sports writers: overblown opinion of themselves and their skills, so they think they can make and break players simply at their whim.

My thoughts exactly.

Man, everyone is against this trade...let it happen!! MGrabow and Gorzelanny have a little more experience than than Hart and Ascaino. How many times have an organization traded away a Cy Young winner? I don't think so with these two guys. I was just at the game, sure Hart pitched okay after the 3rd inning....big deal.

Yeah I know I'm going to get ripped on for this but this trade means NOTHING. Hart doesn't look good to me. He walks a lot of batters and gets into jams. Gorzalany is the same way. I would honestly trade Ascanio straight up for Grabow if it is left-handed pitching I was searching for. I don't think any one won or lost in this trade. My opinion of course...

Let's see....we have Marmol, Guzman, Stevens already. Ascanio did not figure to beat out these three. Hart was a fill-in 5th starter. By reading some of the comments I thought we traded sure-fire Hall of Famers. The fact is that we need another lefty in the bullpen. I expect Marshall will stay where he is and Grabow will be the guy that comes in to face the left handed bat in the late innings. I think Lou wants at least 2 lefties in the pen. It would be great if Ryan could help us this year and if he is ok, we will have 3 lefties in the pen. I like the move. And if Gorzelanny keeps pitching as he has at Indy, he could be up soon and be our fill-in 5th starter.

Harrison may have some upside, but let him get his experience with the Pirates and when and if he gets good and wants to get paid, we could trade to get him back! That is the way the Pirates do business isn't it?

What has happened to all the great prospects we have traded to the Pirates? Bobby Hill where are you?

This is a minor deal and I like it. Nothing to get anybody's feathers in a tither. As always, GO CUBS!

Incidently, the Pirates tried to get Jackson too.

"LOL...Hendry takes the cake...every damn time, doesn't he? In situations where he's dealing from a needs base, he overpays nearly every time.....Trachsel?" Did Trachsel help us? No, but seriously we gave up Rocky Cherry and Scott Moore. Not exactly future hall of famers.

"All they want to think about is how he bombed in 2008, instead of how well he did in 2007 (at age 24), or how he's doing now." Couldn't the same be said for Gorzelanny who won 14 games in '07? Granted he's in AAA now but let's not overestimate Hart who has a 13/18 K/BB ratio this year. If Hart is so good, didn't Hendry pull off the greatest trade getting for Bynum before he got robbed blind by Pittsburgh?

Ascanio has a live arm but he's never going to be more than a setup man. Grabow is a solid lefty setup guy that we needed now so I can live with it. Didn't we trade Infante for Ascanio? That really came back to haunt us too.

Finally I don't know much about Harrison but I'm guessing most people on here didn't either before they looked up his A ball numbers. I think we're fine at 3B with Aramis and Vitters. "Harrison will be jumped up to the bigs next year, and we'll get to see how well he does at 2B for the Pirates for years to come...." Just like Bobby Hill.

Seriously relax, we won today and are playing great. We filled a hole by getting a lefty setup guy. As with most trades this won could go either way, but I'm fairly confident we didn't give up the next Lou Brock.

Wow, I'm not excited about this deal either but one of the worst ever??? C'mon aren't we getting a bit dramatic when we start claiming JH wants to sabotage us?

It isn't the end of the world, no one that we gave up was going to be a cornerstone for the future anyway.

Ehhhhh....Ascanio COULD have been. Fact is, he's a starter, he was brought up to be a reliever, they didn't pitch him for weeks at a time, and then they wondered "Why is this guy not fooling people?" And Hart wasn't going to be a cornerstone for anything. But I can't imagine that, with what he showed in his three winning outings, that the only thing they could muster with him was to package him as a part of a "3 for 2" deal, where the two were a mid-level reliever and a starter who is probably not going to be much better than Rich Hill AFTER Larry Rothschild butchered his delivery.

There are plenty of teams looking for a #5 starter where Hart could have filled the hole marginally (not completely), where we could have maybe included that prospect we traded as well with Hart for a better reliever than Grabow.

There was nothing "good" about this trade. There was nothing "even" about this trade. We gave up another young pitcher that the Cubs tried to pass as an "every five day" use reliever, as well as a pitcher that, with a better pitching coach, could be a very use-able 4 or 5 starter. In exchange, we got a pitcher who NEEDS a good pitching coach (which we do not have) to develop him back into being a "serviceable" pitcher and a lefty reliever. And we also traded a slightly decent low-A player, too.

I can't imagine that Hendry isn't doing this to stack up teams he could potentially work for after this season. This was just an awful trade. If there have been any winners in this trade portion of the season, it's the Pirates. Granted they don't trade away all their guys in the next few years and only sell when they can't use a guy, like the Devil Rays did, this team will be built to destroy the NL Central in three or four years, if not less.

Not crazy about Grabow or Gorzelany.

Ascaino will be missed.

At first glance, this deal could go either way. It's two relatively known (and jury's out re Gorzelanny) lefties) vs. two relatively unknown and jury's out righties. Grabow is an established major leaguer. Not a great record, but pretty good in situations.

Gorzelanny is 27 and has been effective at AAA Indianapolis. I know that he has had some demons along the way, but his line here this season is 4-3, 73 H in 87 IP, only 3 HR and only 30 W vs. 85 SO's. His whip is a solid 1.18. He could be better than Hart, and he is a lefty. We have too few lefties at AAA and AA--so that likely influenced the deal.

He could be a disappointment again too. It's a big if, but should Gorzelanny do well, JH will snatch victory from the jaws of defeat on this trade.

Bobby Cox said that we would like Ascaino when we got him off the Braves' farm. Both he and Hart have shown some signs of good upside. But Hart has been several rungs below Wells in his effectiveness with us.

I haven't checked how well Ryan is doing--but when we signed him, I thought his best chance to do something for us would be next year.

I couldn't agree more about the Hart/Wells comparison. While Kevin Hart has performed admirably when called upon to fill in for injured starters this year, Wells has been almost dominating in some performances and the MLB numbers show it:

Hart: 2.08ERA 1.52WHIP 7.1 H/9 6.6 BB/9 3.7 SO/9 .56 K/BB

Wells: 2.84ERA 1.15WHIP 8.3 H/9 2.0 BB/9 2.86 K/BB

Wells has also post those numbers over a much larger sample size (95 innings vs. 21 for Hart).

I hate to reward Hart's recent success with banishment to Pittsburgh, but Gorzelanny has every bit the chance to be make it.

JimK...Rtan's contract states that the Cubs must promote him to the majors within 15 days of his first rehab appearance or he becomes a free agent.

I agree I don't like the trade, but someone earlier made a good point...

Grabow is type A free agent, so we would pickup 2 high draft picks next year if we let him walk. That is good.

But I think the guy with the higher ceiling is Ascanio, not Hart. I thought his stuff was nasty.

and comparing this to the Brock trade is just asinine. Please, take a deep breath.

If Kevin Hart ends up in the HOF then you crow all you want, but until that happens, chill out. Wow.

Trading Harrison was just like cutting McGehee--the Brewers sure appreciate his .316 BA and that pinch HR last night to win the game and his 8 HR and 33 RBI and .895 OBS--and he plays both 3B and 2B.

Hendry doesn't have the first clue.

I feel like Gorzelanny for Hart is a pretty even trade. Even though Hart has pitched fairly well after the break he hasn't been awe-inspiring.



Gorzelanny had a pretty good MLB campaign in 2007:

14-10 201.2IP 3.88ERA 135K

14 Wins while playing for Pittsburgh isn't too bad, but his 1.40 WHIP that year wasn't great (he was 24 years old)

This year at AAA numbers for Hart and Gorzelanny are as follows:

Gorzelanny: 4-3 87.0IP 2.48ERA 1.18WHIP 85K 30BB

Hart: 3-3 56.1IP 3.20ERA 1.12WHIP 60K 21BB

Both players are 26 years old and have had similar number throughout their coming up through the minors.

Ascanio for Grabow is also basically a wash in my mind as well. If you feel like we HAVE to get left handed then fine, I personally don't share the sentiment but so be it. Ascanio had shown flashes of brilliance but I feel like right handed arms like his for the pen aren't that hard to find. If we do get 2 draft picks for Grabow after the season the we can easily find a new Jose Ascanio at that time no prob.

I didn't have any previous knowledge about Josh Harrison until today but his A-ball numbers this year look pretty good:

373AB 61R 5HR 42RBI 26SB .327/.372/.464

It's hard to tell what those will ever project to but that's why I think we overpaid. Not necessarily with Hart and Ascanio.

Lefties hit .275 against Grabow....wtf. The only guy that needed to be changed in the pen was Heilman who has let an amazing 17 out of 33 inherited runners score. Yet, for some reason JH has such a man crush on him he overlooks this.....again WTF!!!!!!!!!!

Neil...every time you say "This move is confusing"...it turns out to be horrible.

ie Miles/Dero/Gathright etc.

Well...maybe JH plans to go to Colorado and offer them Grabow for EY Jr. ...his personality alone should convince them.

PLEASE, PLEASE, COMPLETE THE SALE SO WE CAN GET BETTER MANAGEMENT IN.

Suzy ... sorry. I hope I am wrong with trading away a little depth.

I don't think you are...either.

But I guess we hope for the best.

Maybe Stevens/Shark/Gorzelanny can do the fifth starters job....I like Marshall where he's been.

If we continue to score 10 to 12 runs a game...another fifth starter should show up!

Hart could possibly be another Wells. At least at this point, he has been for the Cubs.

If we move Marshall to the rotation, who is #3 in the league in inherited runners allowed to score, we greatly weaken our bullpen, WHICH IS WHY WE MADE THE TRADE IN THE FIRST PLACE.

Speechless.

Not a great deal but it wont kill us at all...Hart is ok for the cubs maybe a number 2 for the pirates but that isnt saying much...He was never going to make our rotation on the regular basis...Ascanio was a loss for us but can be replaced and we really dont need him...we have guzman and marmol pitching the 7 and 8 innings...Harrison mite turn out to be good but we are loaded with minor league options in the infield, (vitters, logan watkins, starlin castro, Lee, flaherty and the kid we drafted from LSU this year)so we dealt from a postion of strength there...Gorzelanny is tearing up AAA right now and he might return to his 2007 form, he has as much upside as Hart if not more! Not to mention if we dont want grabow we can let him walk and get prospects since he is a Type A! Lou likes Marshall so he will still be our main guy to get lefties out...It is nice that we have another lefty just in case Marshall gets to over worked...Grabow has piched very well his last 22 innings pitched...

Even when Gorzelanny won 14 games in 07 with a respectable era in the high 3s, look at the BAA -- pitchers with a BAA of .275 don't make it.

Suzy, why would the Cubs want a pitcher that can't cut it on the Buco's roster for a pitcher that just won 3 in a row filling in for our beat up guys? Screw the upside downside thing, like Aaron has said, why in Hell trade Hart right now?!

It makes no sense.

None.

It makes sense because you trade Hart while he has value...this is really the first time he has had any value...remember we got him for fredie bynum lol...While grabow isnt ideal, he is a extra lefty and I dont think Hart was ever going to be that good for the cubs long term... Yea He has had a couple of good starts but his command is awful and once the league gets more film on him he will start getting crushed just wait and see.. Lets give Jeff a chance to start since he is getting paid so much...Cashner maybe?

I actually started laughing...Imagine Hart coming off the field today all pumped....just pitched well in front of 40,000 plus with playoff implications.

Now he gets to pitch for the biggest

perennial AAA team in mlb....Ascanio too.

And where you might get a payday with the Cubs...you have no chance with the stingy Pirates.

What an emotional roller coaster.

NOPE. Another piece of possible future...

for not much.

Next year...is going to be bad.

For who?

Now we get to face Hart later in the year. There's one win Jim just gave us. Look at the bright side. XD

I really am in shock about giving up Hart. I really didn't think we needed to do anything to the bullpen...except lose Heilman. The young guys have stepped up and done a great job for us. I really am just ticked we haven't upgraded 2nd base...that is truely our main weakness. I really like Blanco, if he can keep hitting, but trading away someone like Hart for an average relief pitcher is dumb as far as I'm concerned.

Why didn't they trade Aaron Miles? Nobody on planet earth wanted him.

Speechless. . . no I ain't! That lousy GM Jim Hendry ROBBED THE CUBS AGAIN!!!!

What are we going to do for a starter? Rick Dumpster? I don't get it at all. Hart was doing a job for us, and Ascaino had potential. No potential for Gorza-loser at all. He's awful. AWFUL I SAY!

Thanks, Jim, for another lousy trade!

This trade evidently means pushing Marshall into the rotation. In my view, this is a major downer because he has been SO effective coming out of the bullpen. If my memory doesn't fail me, Marshall has not been nearly as solid as a starter when he has to stretch out innings. So the Cubs possibly weaken the bullpen AND the starting staff in one quick late-hour deal? I'm beginning to subscribe to the ideas of those of you who think Hendry is way overmatched as a GM!

Hart I could understand...Not a lot of upside at this stage...Ascanio really upsets me...we need more arms like his...not less.

BJ Ryan must not look so good right now...The cubs have to promote him

to the majors within the next 2 weeks

or release him.

I wonder if they are planning to put

Marshall back in the rotation now?

With Grabow and Ryan as lefties in the pen.

Actually...when Lilly comes back...we could have a glut of lefties unless there is another trade in the works.

AND Again...what do you do with Miles...

who actually had a good night last night

(3/4) but still only hitting .250.

Gorzelanny is just insurance.

Suzy,

RE: BJ Ryan...he doesn't have the same velocity, and they're not confident he can learn to be more of a finesse reliever on the fly at this point...but, again, why not find out what he can do, then make a move in August if need be...moves are almost always cheaper in August anyhow, and especially this year when teams will not want to place claims, risking salary demands.

I can't understand the Hart trade...Sorry...there's absolutely no justification. I'd like to hear it if there is one, and I can't believe media outlets aren't blasting Hendry for this one. At 26 years old (equal to Gorzelanny), and with a 2.60 ERA (better than Gorzelanny or Grabow have EVER done), I just don't see the logic in trading him away.

Would you be fine if Hendry traded Wells away? My guess is a resounding "NO!!!!" Then how is this even different? Sure, he's made about 11 less starts than Wells, but he has better pure stuff than Wells, which is what projects better later on. Hart was phenomenal, and most people don't give him enough credit. All they want to think about is how he bombed in 2008, instead of how well he did in 2007 (at age 24), or how he's doing now.

Like I said, this trade will live in infamy, and we at least have projectable stats to go off of (aside from Harrison, which is pure speculation on my part). Point is, neither Gorzelanny, nor Grabow even had close to the success Ascanio and Hart have had. To me, that's pathetic research and scouting by Hendry and his crew. PATHETIC!!!!!!!!!!

I think the Pirates just got us back for the Ramirez trade... This one sucks!!

You are absolutely dead right Joe. Funny how the Pirates asked for EY Jr. straight up for Grabow, and the Rockies were like, "are you kidding me? take a hike"

So the Pirates were like, "wow...what sucker is going to overpay for a situational lefty with a career 4.54 ERA? Ah, I know...that sucker GM with the Cubs! Just look at his offseason...he's clearly a sucker"

Essentially that's what the deal was for, right? It was Kevin Hart for John Grabow is what it amounted to, and Ascanio and Harrison for Gorzelanny (which, in my opinion, would've been a fair trade for a lefty doing alright in AAA, with several years big league experience and 2 years with decent success...that's fine. But Hart for Grabow?!? You gotta be kidding me?!? I'm like in a twilight zone. I wanna cover my eyes, and have it not happen, because I just watched a 26 year old starter with excellent stuff throw 6 innings of 6 hit ball with 3 ER, 2 walks, and 4 K's, and finishing the day with a 2.60 ERA on the season for us. He overcame 2 home runs to Lee and Matsui that would've demoralized even Zambrano, Dempster, and Lilly earlier this year, and he fought back, and had an excellent game..

Well, congratulations Hendry, you freaking moron...you just traded an effective 5th starter giving you more than expected on short notice with Demp and Lilly going down for 2 average players.....LMAO...I still cannot believe this joker of a general manager we have.

You guys might laugh...but I had visions of Brock for Broglio, Garland for Karchner, etc.

Mark my words, Harrison will probably be up with them late next year if not earlier. Hart will be dominant in their rotation, and Ascanio will eventually be their closer. All for a one year rental in Grabow essentially, when we already had BJ Ryan in AAA, Gaub doing well in AAA, and Waddell there too...all doing well...all ready to help. PLUS, Marshall in our pen. Why the hell would you trade a pitcher with a 2.60 ERA for a situational lefty, moreover a lefty starter in the minors (that's there for a reason)?

Furthermore, what is Piniella and Hendry's obsession with a "balanced" team. We have Z, Dempster, Harden, Wells, and had Hart (all righties) All have done alright (with the exception of Dempster) in the 2nd half. Hart has done exceptionally well for us. Clearly we've gotten this far with that rotation, and the Dodgers dominated us without even using a lefty last year...So what gives? Furthermore, how did that whole "balanced" lineup work out for us....uh....exactly!!!!! Pen? Marshall has been great. What are you going to do though...use Marshall, bring in a righty to face a righty, bring in Grabow to face a lefty? I'm not a fan of "situational" players at all. You either know how to play at the MLB level and get guys out (or hit guys if you're on offense), or you don't. There's no place in baseball for "glove men" or "situational lefties". It's a waste of roster spots and a waste of resources....unbelievable ladies and gentlemen....UNBELIEVABLE!!!

I'm with you Aaron. This reeks. Just go look at Gorzelanny's numbers. I don't care about his potential.

Damnit. Hart must feel betrayed. Imagine going into the clubhouse after that win and someone pulls you aside says your on your way to Pittsburgh?

Damnit. Damnit. Jimbo...damnit.

I don't mind giving up Hart, but i really like Ascanio's stuff.

Harrison: .320 hitter in first minor league season, fast, steals lot of bases

Hart: useful starter, AND young sub 3 ERA this year in 8 appearances (4 starts)

Ascanio: could be starter or relief...domintating at times in relief mid 3's ERA this year

all for a AAA lefty starter that was banished because he couldn't hack it, and a 30 year old situational lefty with a career 4.54 ERA

If you don't think this is like the Jon Garland for Matt Karchner swap, I don't know what you're watching, or where you're getting your stats

Hart will be a 2-3 starter with the Pirates, and he is good. Excellent slider, good fastball...occasional command issues, but gets the job done

Ascanio will jump into their pen, and possibly take over as closer if they trade Capps, and we've seen his filthy stuff



Harrison will be jumped up to the bigs next year, and we'll get to see how well he does at 2B for the Pirates for years to come....

All for a mediocre lefty starter and an average lefty specialist.

LOL...Hendry takes the cake...every damn time, doesn't he? In situations where he's dealing from a needs base, he overpays nearly every time.....Trachsel?

I warned everyone on here that this would happen....a Trachsel sort of deal. Neither of these guys will help out much.

Thanks Hendry...you just traded our winning pitcher today for a bag of peanuts and cracker jacks....he of the mid 2's ERA...Yeah...that guy

Aaron...what do you think happens to BJ Ryan now?

FWIW, I would be a 2-3 starter with them..

sure...but Gorzelanny? Gimme a break. Dude sucks badly at the big league level. PLUS, he's going to AAA anyhow. Now that we just traded our 5th starter/fill-in for the injured Lilly. Who starts? Samardzija? Sorry, not excited for that. Heilman? Definitely not excited about that. Marshall? Right...so, he struggles in the rotation, does excellent in the pen...now back to the rotation? No thanks...Atkins? Did you see how hard they crushed him today (sure, they were outs, but they hit him VERY hard)

I just don't get the logic here...our rotation is already hurt, right? Demp struggled his last time out, now Lilly's out with knee AND shoulder issues, and you trade a pitcher with a 2.60 ERA that more than did his job in the rotation. I'm not as pissed about Ascanio and Harrison (though they add significantly to the overpaying issue), but taking an effective arm from the rotation? It's irresponsible, and absolutely unforgiveable, don't you think?

Perfectly put! I can't believe we yanked Hart when he was doing quite the job filling in....and for what? A step down? BRING IN STEVE STONE!!!!!

Bring in Steve Stone NOW!

3rd baseman Josh Harrison is the third player.

I like it. Grabow's a Type A, so we let him walk and draft 2 guys who will be at least as good as Hart next year. No problem as far as I'm concerned. Unless we resign him.

i feel we slightly over payed but i can live with it but i dont get y the heck they sent jay down???