http://www.theonion.com/content/news/struggling_mets_combine_to_form

Heilman? Really? This article says it all.

John,

You are right about Fukudome. I will give you that one. However, the Padres are cutting salary and doubt they would have wanted to take on DeRosa's salary at this time.

If Fuk doesn't produce again, then it will be fair to call that signing a failure.

OK Pie and Cedeno we all knew were getting traded 3 months ago so what we got in return was what can be expected

derosa was a favorite of mine but infield--

fontenot is better defensively and will match the offensive numbers with a few more stolen bases than derosa

miles is a cheaper derosa from two years ago who can switch hit off the bench

rest of the infield unchanged

we now have five quality outfielders in which three can play all three spots and NOT derosa in right or left which we saw a lot of in crucial situations defensively last year after domes struggles

as for the starting pitching--

Z, lilly, and dempster return from the start of last year Harden replaces marquis and marshal replaces Hill (overall going from B- rotation to a A- going into 09)

bullpen--

marmol replaces wood closer even swap

greg replaces marmol in 8th slight downgrade shark has more experience and can't be any worse than howry and we have heilman and gaudin if needed (wood and marmol were way overworked last year)

Needs bullpen at the trade deadline and a backup for Ram at third (his name is Vitters sooner than everyone expects-the rays have no doubts right nowwith their young talent)

just remember how active the cubs have been over the past few years at the trade deadline u never know what team will faulter and that key player is all the suddenly available

hey Bush made this deal not JH b/c he was on vacation

John,

You are right about Fukudome. I will give you that one. However, the Padres are cutting salary and doubt they would have wanted to take on DeRosa's salary at this time.

If Fuk doesn't produce again, then it will be fair to call that signing a failure.

Here's a thought on the dominoes falling: If Fukodome did what he was signed to do (left handed hitting run producer), we don't trade Derosa to free salary to sign Bradley. If Fuko was .290, 20, and 90, he's back in RF, we have Derosa, a big potential chip in whatever JH wanted to do. Maybe the Peavey deal works, or maybe we can just go on and build pitching depth by trading Pie, Cedeno, Ceda, and still have money left (no Bradley) for a free agent pitcher. We keep Vitters, Hart, etc.

I have to agree on the booing of Heilman. There are just some pitchers, Howry, Hawkins, Hawkins, Hawkins, that can't handle the pressure of Chicago, but do great on other teams. If Heilmans problem is that he gets booed, then he probably isn't a good fit for this team. Did I mention that I still can't stand Latroy Hawkins?

I am a bit miffed by this one, but I will say this. I am sick of reading Hendry sucks stuff every offseason only to watch the Cubs play well thanks to the moves.

People berated Hendry for signing DeRosa. Not one person stood up and said they were wrong. If Heilman is any good or if we get Peavy, I hope those who said it could never happen eat some crow. If you are going to tear him down for moves that work in the end, be ready to say you were wrong.

Off of the soapbox and still very confused about the last few moves. But I am not going to say this is a "FAIL." How can you possibly say that 3 weeks before spring training even starts.

As people like to say ... "that is why they play the games."

Vitters, Marshall, Hart, Wuertz/Guzman, and Stevens for Peavy. Heilman could be our insurance pitcher when Harden goes down. We only neeed 1 lefty in the pen. Keep Hoffpauir and say no to Uribe!

It's official! The Cubs are now worse than they were a year ago. I know everyone they get can't be superstars, but no one can honestly say they are better this year than last. The Derosa trade was just business. Buy low, sell high. Would have been good business if we got something in return, but business none the less. Last year we were short in the pen so even if Gregg has a good year and puts up Woodies #s then we break even there (still short). Heilman has never had a stellar year. We have a head case in right who will be decent if he doesn't blow by the end of the year (my money's on Zambrano when he does). Here's what we're hoping for: Dempster to have another career year, Zambrano to figure it out (hasn't yet), Lilly to stay hot (He's slightly better than a career .500 pitcher), Harden to pitch more innings than he can (my opinion is he's our ace), D. Lee to wake up at the plate, Soto not to experience a sophmore slump, Fukudome to actually produce for the season (drop the ballerina routine), Soriano to stop swinging at balls outside the strike zone.

I'm frustrated as any Cub fan would be. This last move by Hendry is really bothering. I hope everyday I watch ESPN or jump on the internet that JH has done something to lift my dreary Cub spirit. It won't be long and this offseason will have come to an end and I will have to face the dreaded reality that I will have to wait to next offseason. Maybe, just maybe.

Love this site

Buster Olney has reported that the Cubs and Padres are likely to restart talks.

Critics of our losing Woodie and DeRo need to remember that JH moved Wood, DeRo and Marquis to have $20 mil of payroll availability. That enabled re-signing Demp and signing Bradley plus covering a couple of increases on locked-in contracts. Trading Pie and Cedeno apparently gets us what we could get for out-of-option guys as Lou's bias for more veterans for 2009 seems pretty clear. Heilman and Gregg are veterans, and JH thinks their health will not be an issue.

Getting a couple of guys that Towers reportedly wanted in a deal for Peavy (Olson and Stevens) was encouraging re a trade for Peavy. My take now is that Towers wants a player or two that JH doesn't want included (probably Marshall and Vitters). So JH is assuming he won't trade for Peavy and has moved Olson and added Heilman. Heilman is another decent back of the order or long reliever guy like Marshall, Hart and Gaudin.

As I mentioned in the previous topic, Bruce Levine thinks we could now sign Bakko, add another lefty pitcher and maybe Uribe. That could be it going into 2009. Peavy seem a very long shot. I do think that Towers could cave in the end and trade Peavy for Hart, Wellington Castillo, Wuertz and Stephens plus a guy like the SS/2B, Barney.

John G - best logic of the day!!!

So who's the back up at 3rd?

Heilman is perfect for the Cubs. Now stay with me here. What is my favorite Chicago Beer that I can't get here in Michigan? What beer do I drink whenever I go to Wrigley? (They also truck it down to Mesa and serve it at Hohokam.) Final question is, what is the name of the brewery where said beer is made? The answers are, in order, Old Style, Old Style and G Heilman Brewing Co.

So following my logic, Heilman is perfect for the Cubs. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

Okay, again: Loss of confidence because fans were booing him. We all know New York fans, Mets fans in general, can be brutal. But if they're so bad, how is it there are pitchers and relievers that rebound from bad season while they're over there? He's not going to get special treatment here: he's going to get booed the second he steps onto the field and starts serving up homeruns. And they won't stop until he does better. If he needs us to stop booing him so he can start being a better pitcher, he's in the wrong place. And the thing is, I think he found the right place in Seattle, and now that that's been taken away and he's back in a stressful enivronment, he's going to collapse. Hell, the sheer fact that I'm sure a bunch of other Chicago sports writers are saying the same thing is enough to see that things will not start OR end good for Heilman.

Heilman is not as bad as you guys think. Last year he had a down year because of leg injuries as well as loss of confidence because of the fans booing him every second. He had 3 great years before that. And it doesn't mean the Peavy deal is dead. We can still trade Heilman or Marshall along with Vitters and others for him.

After a winter of trying to stay on the sidelines, I guess I'm ready for baseball again. That being said, all I can say is, I hate that DeRossa is gone, but glad to see Cedeno out. I also have to wonder why Hendry is loading up on pitching. Might be for competition this spring, or maybe part of something bigger.

The DeRosa signing and this...mess, they're two separate things. On DeRosa, the guy was a proven commodity who, at the time, looked like he was going to block Ryan Theriot, a guy who had a hot last half of the 2006 season. What we all didn't realize was how impatient, and rightfully so, Lou would be with Cesar Izturis, partly because we knew OF Lou, but we didn't know Lou.

This year? Everything's a known commodity...it's just that Hendry is trying fit square pegs into round holes. Gregg and Heilman both can claim they had injuries preventing them from succeeding last season, but they're two of many that have claimed that in the past. Can you name more than five of them? No, because they all faded away.

Miles is another square peg. He's fast, he can switch hit...but that doesn't make him a good leadoff guy: he's a utility player, and that's all he will ever be.

And let's not forget that, besides Heilman, who is sounding more and more like a Rich Hill-sized headcase, we also managed to upgrade our bullpen with Luis Vizcaino, ensuring that we will have not one, but TWO, Bob Howry types in the pen this year, barring a miracle trade that gets rid of at least one of them.

Heck, basically the only move Hendry made that is at least a "Question Mark" is Milton Bradley. He's going to be a case where 1) he needs to stay healthy and 2) he needs to actually hit the ball. If he can do both, he'll be alright. But this is the Cubs we're talking about: when do these things ever seem like good investments?

My main question at this point is, why did we trade Derosa for a bunch of pitching prospects? Like many of you I thought the Peavy deal was back on after trading Pie but now I just don't understand. They give up two young players who have a good upside for a guy who couldn't handle the pressure in New York. How do you think he will fair when he blows a lead and gets booed when he walks back to the dugout. These deals make no sense and has done nothing but leave them older then they were last year. Doesn't inspire much hope.

I am so glad everyone has lost faith in Jim Hendry just because he is doing things some fans don't like. Come on people. Hendry is doing the things he feels necessary to take this team to the playoffs and hopefully beyond. Plus his moves have not been anywhere near as bad as people make them out when you take everything into consideration.

Trading away Pie, Olson, Cedeno

For Heilman and Henry W.

Just because you thought they could get more doesn't mean he could. Pie and Cedeno were never going to succeed here because they were out of options and Lou does not want to play them. Therefore, there is not much value there. If they stayed, they would have been released for nothing

Trading Mark DeRosa

For 3 minor league players while adding Aaron Miles

I, like most, like DeRosa, but he was the most expendable and easiest movable piece to move out of the starting line up. Hendry and the Cubs made it a point to get more left handed and to do that, someone had to go. Plus he did not have the huge salary and no trade clauses of others. Perhaps he could have got more, but maybe he liked that deal for certain reasons.

Trading Jose Ceda and letting Wood leave without arbitration

For Kevin Gregg

Hendry did this because he was not ready to pay Wood 10 million dollars a year again. Wood would have probably accepted arbitration and made that much (if not more) again this year. Now Hendry might have given up a bit much in Ceda, but that is what they wanted and Hendry must have thought it was worth it. By saving 5 million here and with Marquis, he freed enough money to sign Milton Bradley.

The main point is that Hendry has earned some trust. He is coming off 2 years of making the playoffs and could have sat by and done nothing and made the playoffs again. Then people would have been screaming that he didn't do enough to fix the glaring problems on the team. Hendry has put together a team that will almost certainly win the central again and will hopefully go farther.

Just because you don't like the deals means they were not the right ones to make. Remember few thought signing DeRosa in the first place was a good idea. Just let things play out and i am sure we will still see October baseball here in Chicago and it can't get any worse than the past two years, could it?

trade for Heilman, 5.+ era,WHY? I'm confused. Oh well, no chance of getting Peavy now.

Good GM or not... I will not argue that but he FAILED this offseason.

Peavy deal would definitely appear to be dead, but who said it was ever alive after the Winter Meetings other than blogs and speculative sports writers?

As for dealing Pie and Cedano, for the Cubs they were at best role players. Their only hope was to step up last year and force Lou to play them, neither did. Fontenot did that, he's made himself a key player for the Cubs - Pie and Cedano didn't. For that matter so did Soto the season before, only he outdid everyone's projections last year.

One of the problems with being a contender is you only carry among the top 25 guys people who can deliver now. I like Pie in particular and hope he succeeds in Baltimore.

As for Heilman, he could be brillant, he could be a bust, but he can fill multiple roles, he's a major league player now not "projected", and he's insurance in case you need Marshall in the pen. Plus, you really gave up nothing to get him.

DeRosa was a sad loss, but as much as I like him a space was needed in the lineup for an impact player. You can argue Bradley is or is not that impact player, but DeRosa came to the Cubs as a role player and left the same way - a very good role player. If Bradley performs then the team is significantly better, if not we would still have come up short as a team with DeRosa playing when we face three righties in the playoffs. Its not about what DeRosa could or could not do, its about replacing his good bat with something better and probably getting a better glove in the process (Fontenot at second). As for losing his versatility, this is a definite step back, but you now have five major league outfielders and there would not have been room for him out there anyway. Your only major risk in this department is if Aram goes down.

Just a few observations from one fan ...

So, Hendry basically has :

* Traded away: Pie, Olson and Cedeno

For: Heilman, and Henry W.

I think he could have received more

* Traded away: Mark DeRosa

For: 3 minor league pitchers and signed AAron Miles

* Traded Away :Jose Ceda and let Wood leave. (Not even offering him arb therefore forfeting a chance to recieve draft pick (s)

For: Kevin Gregg

I'm scratching my head right now.

Well said!

I laughed a bit when I read this. To sum it up, basically Heilman was expecting to stay a Mariner and was even to the point where he showed up at their fan-fest and talked about how he was anxious to be a Mariner:

"Zduriencik thanked Heilman for his professionalism. Heilman dutifully attended a weekend fan function at frigid Safeco Field last weekend and talked enthusiastically about getting a fresh start outside New York, which mostly despised him after he blew five saves in eight chances last season."

So, he goes to a horrid team where he expects to get a fresh, no-pressure start and has no expectations thrown his way to a team where they're actually a playoff contender, will eat him alive if he does that "blow five out of eight" nonsense, and will be put into a high pressure situation.

Let me re-emphasize myself:

FAAAAAAIIIIIILLLLLLLLLLL!

How can anyone still think cubs are getting Peavy ? Pie is gone, Olson is gone, Derosa is gone, Cedeno is gone. All these guys were supposedly part of the Peavy deal. Who are we going to give SD now, Michael Wuertz ? Vitters or no Vitters, me thinks Peavy deal is DOA.

I wouldn't say the Peavy deal is dead yet ... this deal makes Marshall and Hart more expendable. Olsen wasn't ready to step in ans be a starter at the major league level yet. Maybe you can move Marshall (who perhaps San Diego prefers over Olsen), Hart, Hill, Stevens and Castillo for Peavy ... which:

1. Keeps Vitters in the Cubs system

2. Gives us a solid 7th inning guy in Heilman so the Shark get innings as a starter in AAA; and

3. If a starter goes down with an injury, ether Heilman can movie into the rotation with the Shark filling the 7th inning role or vice versa.

Wow. I'm really stunned by this one. I know Cedeno was out of options and not likely to make the club, but Aaron Heilman? In this move, Hendry hasn't done anything to improve the club or the farm system and seems content to trade prospects for any cast-off he can find. Maybe he can coax Ed Lynch out of retirement to anchor his new bullpen.

So much for Peavy.

This is not a good trade. At the very worse you could have just kept Olsen and seen what the kid had he was a a top 50 pick whos a lefty and hes only 25. Now we get a guy who had a terrible year last year and is 30 sounds like a bad deal to me. Oh and you loose Cedeno who if he got to play all the time would be better then Fotenot and possibly Theriot

Cedeno played full time once. That was ugly. No loss.

But I agree fully on Olsen unless the Padres would prefer Marshall over Olsen.

So the Cubs do a two-on-one trade, one of which was a target of the Padres, for a reliever who's starting to turn into everything that Bob Howry was shooting for last year? I don't say this much, but for this trade, why not:

FAAAAAAIIIIIILLLLLLLLL!

Heilman can start or relieve for us and is 1 year removed from having a good stretch with the mets. I liked the trade better when we kept Olson but cedeno wasn't going to make the team and was out of options. Olson was probably going to AAA or be traded. This still sets up a Peavy trade down the road or adds depth to our pitching staff. If Marshall starts or becomes center of trade Heilman is the swing man we need with the injury question marks of our very stellar starting staff. What we also don't know is if the Padres wanted Heilman as well. His salary is about 1.2M and could start for them. If we get Peavy everything makes sense and if not we are stil better today than last week. Have to love the pitching depth. Go Cubs!

I think it comes down to this with Peavy. I think JH decided they weren't going to give up Vitters in a deal for Peavy, and Padres wouldn't do the deal w/o Vitters. So I think the cubs decided to move on from Peavy, which doesn't bother me at all.

Personally, I like Peavy, but I was against it if we lose Vitters. He is supposed to be a real difference maker. And the only one we really have in our farm system. You have to keep those kind of players, and there are too many red flags with Peavy IMO. I've heard they are concerned about health issues. He has had some arm injuries the couple of years. That's not good.

Kind of like how Pie was going to be a difference maker.

Until the Cubs can develop positional talent, I say trade them for stars.

I STILL wouldn't give up on Pie, he's never had a chance. He may do well in Baltimore away from all the pressure of Chicago with ample playing time.

Now Vitters has to be included in a Peavy deal.

I hope he proves me wrong, but I wouldn't. We wouldn't trade Pie last year for Brian Roberts, and this year we trade him for a releif pitcher coming off of a horrible year, and most of last year he whined how he wanted to be in the starting lineup. Like I said, I hope I am wrong, but I just don't understand this.

Either the Cubs and San Diego have agreed to a deal that doesn't include Olsen and are awaiting ownership approval, or the Peavy deal is dead. If Olsen is out of the deal, it must mean Vitters will be in. However, I would be really surprised at this point if any deal is done at all for Peavy - maybe at the trade deadline.

Re - Larry... couldn't agree more. I know this offseason is not over but to this point in my perspective JH has misplayed his hand TERRIBLY thus far.

If we didn't trade Pie for Olsen with the intention of getting Peavy then that trade is a MAJOR LOSS in my books.

I'm predicting that the Cubs, Bears, and Bulls will have new general managers in 2010. Book it.

What a sad time to be a chicago sports fan...

Again, I like this deal. Just looked up Heilman's 2009 write-up in Fantasy Sports magazine ... "He struggled in the pen in 2008 as he battled a knee injury the entire year ... With better health he'll return to the levels he showed in 2006 and '07 ... For 2009, project ... 3.55 ERA and 1.22 WHIP." I'll take two years of a set-up guy with that ERA and WHIP for Pie and Cedeno.

I am a fan of Hendry, but I am starting to lose my faith in him. Outside of the Bradley move I don't like any of the moves he has made. I really don't understand this one at all.

So we have basically traded Pie(he got us Olson), Cedeno, and Ceda, for Kevin Gregg and Aaron Heilman. I really hope moves like this is not what Crane Kenney is referring to.

I really hope Hendry can do something to redeem himself.

I hope this ends the talks about getting Peavy. I see Peavy as something we really don't need. The Cubs won 97 games last year with Z, Demp, Lilly, Harden and Marquis. Put Marshall in the 5th spot and go from there. All this talk about switching from starter to reliever to starter for Marshall is crazy. Let him start and I am sure he will give us more than Marquis did. This will put the bullpen in a stable condition where everybody knows their job.

Can Peavy start all of the playoff games? Hell, Lilly did not even start one last year! And Peavy has a history of arm trouble. I don't think he is worth our best ranked minor leaguer (Vitters). Now, if we did not have pitching I could see why we could use a Peavy.

They went out and got some lefties to balance the lineup. The pitching was not a problem last year and with the guys we have right now I am sure it won't be a problem this year. As always, GO CUBS!

This trade doesn't make a lot of sense. Didn't they trade for Olson to send him to San Diego as part of a deal for Peavy?