I'm not ready to give the closer role to Marmol just yet.

I sure wished that the Cubs would get at least one quality starting pitcher. Zambrano a ligit #1, Lilly a #4 at best a #3, Rich Hill a #5 at best a #4. So you see, compared to the contenders in the National League (Mets, etc.) the Cubs have the worst starting pitching. They have enough to maybe win the division again this year, but to get past the Mets, and/or Arizona, will not be easy with a rotation like the Cubs. So us Cub fans will endure another year to make 101 with out a World Series championship, or even a World Series appearance. You can't have 5 pitchers competeing for the #4 and #5, #1 through #4 should be a lock.

I agree I would really like to see one more quality pitcher added to the staff, but I would NOT say that we have the worst pitching staff, we lead the NL in Strikeouts last year, and we were third or fourth in ERA.

Lilly a 4? Hill a 5? Do you even watch baseball????

I dream for the day I browse this website and see no mention of Brian Roberts or Erik Bedard.

This time of year is maddening!!! BASEBALL FEVER!!!!

CATCH IT!!!

Lilly a #4??? and Hill a 5?? What planet are you from man?? Not many 4s win 15 games...and Hill is still young with a load of potential. To say we have the worst rotation of the other national league contenders is not correct . Why do the Mets have the best now??? Because they now have Johan?? The Mets will still have to win because of their offense, not because of their #1 pitcher followed by mediocracy. I will say Arizona has a very strong 1-2 punch, but after that mediocre. Sure we made them look very good in the playoffs last year, but teams get hot and cold and the playoffs are a different beasts, look at the Giants. But if the Cubs can acquire another solid pitcher via free agency or trade either now or during the season they will, in my humble opinion, have the best 1-5...on paper that is.

Regarding the rotation, I was just wondering:
Would anyone argue against,
#1 - 18 wins
#2 - 15 wins
#3 - 15 wins
#4 - 12 wins
#5 - 10 wins
Tot= 70 wins
I would expect the rest of the staff to pick up 15-20 wins minimum amongst themselves...
Once again Lilly was 15-8 last year, if he's a #4 he's an over-achiever. The bottom of our rotation is my concern, not #1-#3. Lieber will pull his weight if he wins 10-12 games, I like Marshall's chance of winning 10-12 games more than Dempster's and I don't see Marquis here for a whole season. Other than being a B class free agent, I'm not sure why we didn't go after Livan Hernandez (a great inning eater)? He would thrive in the bottom of the rotation.

I know everyone wants to add the likes of a Bedard or other established starter, but I think it would be great and somewhat refreshing if we gave a chance to someone like Sean Gallagher or Hart to step in and make an impact in this rotation. We all know that Lou enjoys using his young players and we have seen him do it with some success, so why not give those guys a shot. Trust me, if it were doable without losing the farm, I would go for a Blanton or Bedard, but right now it seems like both guys are going to require too much to get for maybe 15 wins...lets see if someone we have right now can give us 12 at the end of the rotation. I think marshall shows promise, and don't forget, a guy by the name of Greg Maddux also endorses him, and I think what he says should hold some weight. I really think we are underestimating our farm system and young arms. I'm still predicting a great year from Hill 18 wins(including post season...)

Okay, the Mets paid a substantial amount of $ for Santana. Sure, he's good......what happens if he gets hurt? HUH? Then what?

I'm calling it....Santana get hurt this year, let's say....mid June, and plays only half the season. Then what do we all do? Laugh????

I have seen Rich Hill in AAA Iowa Cubs many times and he was dominant with what I remember to be a 20 K performance through 8 innings. Yes it was AAA but with a full year under his belt, I can easily see him winning 15-18 games again this year. He is not a #4, more like a #2. Honestly Lilly was in his first year in the NL and he surprised me with his performance. If he can do it again this year, I will be a believer.

Our pitchers have led the league in strikeouts for the last 7 years. We have a good rotation, Not a championship rotation. Lilly is a solid #3, he will fall back to earth this year. How can you even say Hill is at best????????????? Last year was his first full year on the team. I see him winning 15 games this year with a 3.12 ERA 205 K's. We should probaly throw Pie out as well he has 177 career at bats. Theriot ran out of gas the first time he has played a 162 game scedule, get rid of him. Soriano was a disappointment in his first year, get rid of him. Yup all that sounds stupid too.

I am very interested in what Hart is going to do in Spring training. If he starts off like he ended last year, he is not going to make it a very easy decision for Sweet Lou. I think he is going to be a huge asset to either the rotation or bullpen.

There is always one surprise coming out of Spring training, two years ago it was Big Sean Marshall, last year was Theriot, who will it be this year? Can't wait to find out.

Lows- I remember Marshalls debut, it was a Sunday night game televised on ESPN against the Cardinals. He didn't throw a No hitter, but he pitched a very good game against the eventual world champs. Not and easy task to do when your debut is against a very good team on a nationaly televised game.

Man I am ready for next week, let's get this thing going!!!!

The pitching has never been a problem for us.

But our team ranked 7th from bottom in HR, 11th from bottom in OBP, 11th from bottom in SB, 11th from bottom in triples, 12th from bottom in total runs, 11th from top in average

We had a pretty lousy offensive year, and the total difference from then to now is Subtract JJ, Add Fukudome.... Is this going to move us to the top in offensive numbers???

Look I am not saying that the Cubs have the worst rotation in baseball. And, yes I watch baseball, that is why I am saying that the Cubs need to add a bonefide quality starting pitcher before any of us Cub fans can come to terms with ourselves of a World Series on the Norh Side. Bottom line!
I hope Ted Lilly can win 15 games again, Rich Hill gets better. But that is our #1, #2, & #3 go to guys on every 5 days, then you throw in Marquis (pewh, he stinks), Lieber (?), Marshall (?), Dempster (can he actually be better as a starter, NOT), oh and I forgot Hart, Gallagher, Guzman, etc. Does this rotation sound like World Series Championship caliber? Again, NOT!!

Having guys with hig OBP will help our numbers tremendously. Its a fact that it is much tougher to pitch with men on than bases empty. So if Theriot has a better year, which he should second time around, Fukodome's OBP should translate over to the MLB, and not to mention Derosa(if getting regular playing time and ABs his OBP should be up), our big hitters (Lee, Aram, Alf) should have much better production than last year. Another thing...if Soto can somehow reproduce his offense of last years limited play, we will also see some mid to late lineup thunder that will help protect Aram and keep innings alive. Hopefully this chain reaction comes to fruition and this team can click. I personally think this team is one year away from being a world series winning team, but baseball is crazy. If this team is able to win the division (which it should) and get hot at the end, who knows. Its going to be a very interesting and exciting season, can't wait for it to start...

Going around the league a little, lets see what staff would I rather have?
1-Zambrano
2-Lilly
3-Hill
4-?
5-?

Mets
1-Santana
2-Pedro
3-Maine (15 wins)
4-Perez (15 wins)
5-Elduque

DBacks
1-Webb (18 wins)
2-Haren (15)
3-Davis
4-Randy Johnson
5-Gonzalez

Braves
1-Hudson
2-Smoltz
3-Glavine
4-James
5-Hampton/Carlyle

Brewers
1-Sheets
2-Bush
3-Suppan
4-Vargas
5-Capuano/Villanueva/Gallardo

That is just a taste of some of the staffs around the league.

Well, after Johan, Maine is solid, Perez isn't as good as advertized, The D-backs are pretty weak after their 1-2 (johnson is ancient, no longer effective), the same could be said about the Braves...and the Brewer's rotation just sucks, so I think we're in pretty good shape as far as the NL goes...the AL is a different story, but we'll worry about that if we get there.

I failed to mention my feelings about Pedro...I doubt they will be able to get more than 5 innings per start out of him and he more than likely won't make it the entire season due to injury. He's old, maybe a good 4 or 5, but not a 2...noway, Maine will take that spot

I wouldn't be counting out Randy Johnson and Pedro just yet. Both are said to be 100% and ready to go.

cubsbaseball,

I agree that our #4 and #5 spots are huge ?????. But 1,2,3 I am comfortable with. Marquis will start off good like he usually does then we need to dump him. Dempster needs to go. Marshall(if around) I don't mind in the 5spot. There was no point in signing Lieber. In my opinion he is useless now.

Lets hope the Spring Training standout is someone that can fill a rotation spot and do it well.

Loes - What Brewers pitching staff are you referring to?

"...and the Brewer's rotation just sucks..."

Sheets - When healthy is close to an ACE when healthy.

Gallardo - Allowed 7 earned runs in last 6 starts of 2007 as a rookie. Probably not a fluke being that he is a uber prospect.

Villanueva - Entering his 3rd season and hasn't allowed an ERA over 4 yet. Also had 99 K's in 114.1 innings last year.

Capuano - he should be 100% after offseason surgery and is 3 years removed from 18 wins. (that's as many as Zambrano has ever won).

Suppan - While nothing to brag about he could definately hold his own versus most any other #4 or #5 in the league. He did win the NLCS MVP just a couple years ago remember. Another fun fact about SUPPAN I saw on Wikipedia... He has 2 career homeruns (both off of Steve Trachsel).

Too many "ifs" about the Brewers staff, therefor I stand by my statement that its really no good. Sheets yes, when healthy is an Ace...but he's too prone to injury to count on for a full year. Dave Bush will be in that rotation somewhere, probably as a number 3...he's an okay 4. Capuano was 5-12 last year. He lost 12 games in a row....................his last win was May 7th...if he was hurt ALL season, he's an idiot and should have sat because losing 12 games in a row does nothing good for your team, so he's bogus. But sure, 3 years ago he won 18 games...but thats 3 years ago. Suppan was 12-12 with a 4.62, I'll agree, not a bad number 5. Villanueva had 6 starts last year, they may move him into the rotation as a 4, leaving Gallardo to be the number 2, which will be a good spot for him, talent-wise, but tough having only 110 innings in the big leagues. We'll see, but I don't see them as being a strong, reliable staff. IF Sheets is healthy, he'll be allright, IF Gallardo can do what he did last season, then yes, solid number 2, IF Dave Bush is a number 3, he'll suck because he sucks, so no real IF there......IF Capuano bounces back after losing 12 straight, he may not lose 12 straight again, but probably won't win 12 either, IF Suppan can return to his Cardinal form, then okay, yes, he probably won't be their number 5, but probably their number 3, making it a good if not great number 3, but IF, IF, IF...

IF's work both ways... my point is they definately do not suck as previously mentioned.

Well, there are definitely worse rotations around the league, but in terms of probable "contenders" they are far and away the cellar dwellers

I know I haven't said this before, but I too believe we need at least another #2 guy. Say what you want but our rotation without Big Z... is very average. Every rotation depends on "if's" ; But we might have the solution In-house, especially if Hill [who was aggressively inquired by other teams and apparently we kept] lives up to his potential and a kid like Hart/Gallagher/Veal or Samardija becomes a solid #3 like Hill did last year.

Then a rotation of
Carlos
Rich
Sean G.
Ted
Sean M.
And a bullpen that has Lieber and Hart could be very deep. That is a big IF…but realistic.

Note; I call pitchers by their first name because we hang out often. Carlos eats “arepas” [Venezuelan fritters] like crazy and Richie blow dries his hair every day!

Hey baron keep in mind Soto could be a mayor factor offensively and definitely on defense. Maybe these two guys are the answer since last year we “apparently” were one guy away of scoring those big innings. Pie is young and he might take longer but if he hits somewhere near he has in the minors, we will have a championship.
{{IF}}again _obviously

Augustin:

I'm sure Carlos washes down his arepas with a bottle of Cerveza Polar.

Yup!Jim[TP]...that is a very good beer.

I say again. Say what you want, have those every year dreams of the Cubs winning the World Series, but if they win the National League Central again this year, that is as far as they go. San Diego, NY Mets, and others have a better rotation than the Cubs. And there shouldn't be any 'ifs' in a contending team rotation, it should be solid goign in to spring. It will be another waiting year!

And so what. Someone has to win, and all the others don't. Our team will be competitive, and with hopeful health and momentum at the right time, anything can happen.

Gosh, this group is so darn pessimistic. It's just a sport.