Hmm

Ok, JJ aint no stud, but he got traded for a total lemon.... This was super-boneheaded...

Omar Infante? Sometimes, Hendry is as dumb as a hippopotamus

Ok, so how does this help us? Instead of a glut of OFs, we not have an overcrowded IF...So he becomes a utilty player. We traded out CF who batted .330+ in the second half for a utility player. We better get Fukudome!!!

long time reader, first time posting...could this be setting us up for a bigger trade? the Rays were saying they liked cedeno, we obviously like crawford, so maybe we are setting ourselves up for something big!

for some reason this guy reminds me of jerry hairston jr. ... how did that work out? i dont know why we traded jj after we got rid of floyd and monroe...jj would have been a good back up and he is in the last year of his contract...we already have a great utility guy in derosa and i just dont understand

How can anyone be annoyed with this trade. Regardless of what Jacque did in the second half, he was marginal (at best), and wanted out of the city.

This is a salary dump measure, and will lead to something bigger and better. I also sense with the Infante pickup that Cedeno or Fontenot may be gone soon. There's more coming, so we should calm down. And we should throw a party for Hendry for finally getting a taker for ol' Jacque.

"How does this help us?" I don't understand why folks aren't getting this.

It's a salary dump and getting rid of player that doesn't want to be here. Yes he had a good second half, but he also had a horrible first half... and he's been pretty vocal about what he thinks of playing in Wrigley - hates the fans. ESPN had a blurb that the Cubs were expected to cover $1 mil left from his signing bonus... but the article above said "The Tigers sent utility infielder Omar Infante and cash considerations to Chicago." so we're getting cash in the deal. It evens out.

Fukudome isn't the only player out there - there's also the two Japanese pitchers PLUS all the available higher salary players on the block from different teams. We needed the room in the budget.

Is Jones a better hitter than Infante? Maybe. He hit .330+ after the break last year... with zero power (3 dingers). He ain't all that people. Pie is a better option in the OF, plus we're looking to pull another OF bat somewhere else (Fukudome, Crawford, etc) that are all better options than Jones.

This is only the first move of the offseason and that's all it is. It frees up budget and gives Hendry some leeway in making other moves.

Either way - it's not a move that will cripple the team or put us over the top. It's Jones for Infante. Sheesh.

Why all the angst?

A little perspective is in order :-)

I agree with this being a good move. Even if we outright cut him, Infante still saves us at least 3 million next year.

Wasn't everybody here pissed when the Jones to Florida deal got nixed in the commissioners office? The guy came here to play for Dusty Baker, so why would we want him around? I also cannot imagine that something else is in the works, because we now do have a lot of infielders.

Cedeno + somebody else for Crawford looking better and better. Plus, I hope that this means that the Matsui deal is DEAD. Now that one would really piss me off.

Anything out there yet on Kerry Wood. They lose the right to negotiate tommorow or Wedsday. The guy is the heart of the team, they have to re-sign him.

I hate to say it but some of you are ignorant. All of us at some point called for Jones to be traded last season. The trade is not about what we got it is about what we lost. We lost a free swinging, strikeout prone, noodle arm, and $5 million dollars off the books. I believe Infante is set to make $1.3 million. He is a great utility guy who can play almost every position.

Most importantly, it frees us up to make a big signing!

Lol. Thanks Gary. I don't like the deal right now, but you're right, I'm not losing sleep over it. Its not like we just traded Hill for a AAA guy. And I'll admit, I called for JJ's head more than once the first part of the season last year. I just hoped that the way Jones came on in the second half, he may have had more value than this.

Addition by subtraction. Hendry will now either:

* Sign a FA like Fukodome or Jose Guillen.

* Make a trade

I'm a tigers fan, who's uindecided about the trade from this end.
I can tell you one thing Omar Infante can bring to a team. The kid can hit a fastball. I think the best situation for him IS in the national league where he can come in, pinch hit against a reliever who relies on blowing the ball by guys. he won't get the ball thrown by him. Defensively, he's solid, probably hasn't had enough time in the outfield where I would be confident playing him there. But as a second baseman, I wouldn't be worried about a lot of errors. above average range
Omar Infante never really got a chance in Detroit.But the front office always raved about him until Jimmy Leyland came to town. so My best guess is a work ethic issue. He played everyday in 2003. Where nobody on that team had a chance. I'm glad he will hopefully get a chance somewhere else.
But there's nothing nice to say about Craig Monroe, trust me, you don't want me.

I can tell you one thing Omar Infante can bring to a team. The kid can hit a fastball. I think the best situation for him IS in the national league where he can come in, pinch hit against a reliever who relies on blowing the ball by guys. he won't get the ball thrown by him. Defensively, he's solid, probably hasn't had enough time in the outfield where I would be confident playing him there. But I wouldn't be worried about errors with Infante at 2b
Omar Infante never really got a chance in Detroit. He played everyday in 2003. Where nobody on that team had a chance. so, I'm glad he will hopefully get a chance somewhere else.
But there's nothing nice to say about Craig Monroe...

I just read at mlb.com that the cubs are possible suitors for M rivera and gange. I never heard this before.

Ben you call people on this site ignorant and yet you were the one who said Gagne was good for the Red Sox? You do have a point in that JJ is a POS.

I read that too Phil - basically they only had the Cubs interested in the closers among the top 25 free agents. I know I've said it before, but don't count out the top Japanese closer that's becoming a FA this year. I'd rather have him than Gagne or Rivera. Both of those guys seem to be on their downslide.

...but if the Japanese guy goes off the market, I wouldn't mind either one of them... but only as long as we can keep Wood as a backup plan :-)

I'm hoping the next big news from the Cubs front office is they've managed to keep Wood from testing the market. Exclusive negotiating rights end tonight.

Agustin, I do believe that I said some people are ignorant and I admitted that I should not have included Gagne in my example of what we should do. I am sorry that I find it ignorant and short sighted of some people thta are bashing this trade. This is a great day. If only we can find somebody to eat Marquis' salary now!

what exactly makes Infante a 'good utility guy'..

Simply fielding 6 positions doesn't make you a good player. An Orangutan can catch a ball anywhere in the field too. His hitting is in the Henry Blanco/Koyie Hill class.. which is to say, really sucks!!

I sure hope the FUKODOME, FUKODOME fever everyone seems to be on pans out... or we are now going to have an unproven CF in Pie, nobody in RF, Murton in LF.. That might be the WORST outfield in baseball.

I'll wait till the offseason is over before I comment on this deal, however I do like the money it possibly freed up. Also, baron I think you forgot that we have some guy named Soriano in LF.

my bad

trading JJ was always on the cards, and is a wise-move... but why is a $3-4 million dollar salary dump so huge.. were talking about a 100+ million dollar payroll... less than 3% --- at a minimum, we should have gone for some young farm talent from Detroit instead of a Neifi clone.

Guys...Infante is just a back up resource. C'mon, Pinella and Hendry aren't that clueless (tho sometimes with Hendry you wonder). Cedeno is being shopped (who is marketable), and perhaps Fontenot. And Infante may not even make the roster come spring training.

Do you really think that the Cubs will open next season with Soriano, Pie and Murton all starting in the OF? Please. With Fukodome, Crawford, and Rowand out there as possibilities, something will come this way. It's only November 12th, and things usually get hot in the December meetings. This is just a setting of the table.

As mentioned earlier, let's have some patience! We've already trimmed Traschel, Floyd, Monroe, Kendall and Jones, and the season is just a couple weeks over. Great moves so far!!

Ben, I do believe is a great day too and it really is good to see JJ go...I just don't think calling people ignorant will help your case convincing people to adopt your thoughts. An [ignorant] is a person that lacks knowledge and you are using it on people that differ from your point of view. That is my view and I'll leave it at ease. You do make other good assessments.

Baron, I am not so high on that Fukodome “unproved” guy. I would prefer if we go for Crawford and second choice Rowand....lastly the Fukidomi guy that appears to have mlb caliber, but who knows??? It would be a gamble over the sure thing with Crawford. Two of them will not happen and we don’t need a new team, we just need to get a star RF and a starter.

Hey I think a lot of teams would take Marquis in a heartbeat. I would not mind him being traded because I believe the relationship between him an Lou is not very good right now…but he is a solid 5th starter in any league. [The problem the Cubs have is that they always want a second rate player to be a star and that is Marquis]

well said Mark

Baron,
Detroit would not have given us "young farm talent" for Jones. I'm sure Hendry would have preferred that option if it was available to him. As for our 2008 outfield, it is likely to look like Soriano in LF, Pie in CF, and a high end guy through free agency (or possibly trade) in RF.

Gary J,
I believe the top tier Japanese closer that was thinking of coming over to MLB decided today that he is going to stay in Japan.

Agustin, I agree that Marquis will likely be shipped off as well. Pinella has lost confidence in him, and you can see the trend happening with the club (which is great...get rid of the has-been dead weight that don't produce).

We still have Cedeno, Dempster, Marquis, Ohman, and maybe a Marshall and Murton to shop. It would be nice to find out the dispositions on Wood and Prior soon though.

And "Mark", some really good posts on your part today.

this couldn't have been done last off-season?

Jason B:

YOU KNOW BETTER!

Jason, Jim...LOL!

sorry...guess I posted this originally on the other topic----I meant to post here:

the trade for Infante makes absolutely no friggin' damn sense.....unless it's to flip him to another team that was interested in him for a larger deal---Crawford? Tampa is interested in a defensive upgrade at short----maybe that was the thinking?

I'm thinking something's up.....but, hey, didn't we all think the same thing last year after we signed Floyd and Ward, and still kept Jones?

Quality GM's make quality moves.....This is not a salary dump......which would be the only excuse for making a move like this---as Jones is a quality back-up and decent starter-----NO, this was a BONE-HEADED move again by Hendry.

Unless he flips Infante, as was said on here earlier---you have Theriot, Cedeno, Fontenot, DeRosa, Infante, AND Eric Patterson is in the mix. That's 6 DAMN middle infielders.

Look, DeRosa sucked donkey balls with his GIDP in the playoffs with the bases loaded and a hitters count, but he was SOLID-----absolutely solid. So the only need would be offense at the SS end of it all. I guess Hendry thought Infante was the second coming of Carlos Guillen....or Rollins....or whatever.....Hell, maybe his career average numbers don't tell the whole story----maybe he just didn't like Detroit, and their coaches sucked.....LOL, what an absolute load of crap this is. Infante as a back-up OF? Are you kidding me!?!?! Pagan can do better than that for half his salary.

THis folks, is why Hendry should be fired...If I was an owner, looking at his trades----he doesn't survive another day. He doesn't get value from his trades. He doesn't buy low and sell high. I'll credit him with a few good trades, even if I think the other teams didn't care who they got because they were salary dumps anyhow----and he made the Lilly, DeRosa, Howry, Eyre, and Soriano signings.....and in the past, Alou-----but that's just it folks....those are his signature signings, and his bad ones, and bad trades are starting to really piss me off, and I know they're upsetting some of you all as well.

Infante?!?! I laugh my ass off at that. Dude hits Neifi-esque numbers, and we just got rid of him because he sucked.....Why trade a decent player away for Neifi's twin, and create a logjam in our middle infield?

Now if we flip Infante in a trade for a Crawfod like player or someone that can ACTUALLY make a difference, then hats off to him.....but if history is indication---no, this is just another headscratcher of a move from the Hendry.

We constantly block our young guys with stupid moves like this. Would it really have hurt to give Hoffpauir or another one of our young outfielders a shot last year instead of signing Floyd? Ditto Marquis.

Even though I don't like it, I think we have to do whatever it takes to sign Fukodome even if it means signing Matsui...If we don't, then we'll really have egg on our face. If we indeed make that move, then it makes Hendry look even WORSE for Infante as we'd have 7 middle infielders then.

I don't buy the salary dump thing either as we were going to eat salary for trading Jones anyway, which would negate that argument. When you salary dump a player, you get a low level minor leaguer that either is close to being ready, or has a high ceiling and wouldn't require a 40 man spot, thus biding you time to develop him.

With you Aaron. Remember last season when all of us here were scratchin our heads saying, "well maybe that trade was to help set up a future trade."

That "future trade" never happened.

This doesnt make any sense, but Ill take the extra clear spot to get a Rowand or Fukodome.

That's certainly a lot of late night emotion Aaron.

Hey, I'm certainly one of the first to pan Hendry for the Willis, Trachsel and Pierre deals. But let's see, Derrick Lee, Aramis Ramirez, Ted Lilly, Mark DeRosa, Alfonso Soriano, Bob Howry. My gosh, Hendry did great with these moves.

Pinella loves Theriot, so he's not moving. News out of Colorado is that Matsui will likely resign, so he's likely not coming to logjam the infield further.

Nothing is happening without Pinella's input, and Lou I believe is looking for character players. You look at the present roster and the Cubs have youth in Zambrano, Soto, Theriot, Murton, Hill, Marshall, Pie, Hart. And quite a few "good character" kids in the minors, who showed well in stretches this last season.

If this was January/February I'd say "bash away" at today's move. But Jones was not good, and this early November move is just the start of bigger and better things. Let's have some faith folks.

Looking at Jacques stats, it's not impressive. never hit 30 bombs, doesn't steal bases, strikes out way to much, not alot of walks, and the OBP is also not so good. The upside on Pie in my opinion is much better. lower salary, much younger.

like I said about Infante before, I really think he can blossom in the national league. if used correctly. On the flip side, he seems to be the kind of guy who gets in a rythm (which is obvious by his batting stance). So who knows how a pinch hitting role will help him. either way, it would be many more at bats than he ever got as a tiger.

other teams better bring in strikeout pitchers in to face detroit. with 100k a year guys Jones, Thames, Granderson, Rodriguez, and inge, it's strikeout heaven now...

PS, Neifi Perez is a free agent, as long as you're willing to wait a hundred or so games for the Steroid suspension to wear off. better act fast, the rest of the league is jumping at the opportunity.

hmmmmmmmmmmmmm

blossom in the NL?!?!?! You gotta be kidding me. Jones will do far better in the AL with subpar pitching, but if you do research and look at stats, players that go from the NL to AL do much better if they're a hitter, and pitchers that go from the AL to NL do much better.....it's an inverse relationship.

Statistically speaking, Hendry was fooled with Jones....He thought his 25+ 85 rbi+ numbers would hold up in the NL....but they didn't. The NL takes above average hitters in the AL, and makes them average hitters at best in the NL. The reason is simple....the AL has the DH, and the NL doesn't. THis means that players in the AL have a much better chance of posting large batting numbers, because there's more runners on base usually, and the order doesn't get split like it does with the pitcher's spot in the order in the NL.

Personally, I think Infante will actually be worse than he was in the AL. Jones will flourish in Detroit---probably hit 25-30 bombs, and drive in 90

bad, bad move by Hendry, and very miscalculating....as I said--6 infielders...Could we not find one that can outperform Infante!?!?!

Versatility? Cedeno plays 2b and SS, and rumor has it he's working in the OF as well this winter. DeRosa plays RF, 2B, SS, 3B, and even 1B. Theriot plays SS, 2B, 3B, CF, and even RF. Patterson plays 2B, SS, and CF. Fontenot plays 2B, and SS.

Please, versatility is the biggest load of crap excuse I've heard from him. And don't tell me we couldn't have gotten a lower level decent prospect for Jones, because we would've had that from the Marlins. Other teams like the Phillies, Angels, Rangers, A's, and Rays inquired about Jones last year.....You can't tell me that at least one of them didn't offer a decent low level prospect.

Anyway, here's to hoping Hendry makes a splash and signs a Kuroda, Fukodome, Rowand, Affeldt, or Rivera-type of player........AND PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THINGS CUBBIE....PLEASE SIGN WOOD!!!!!!!

Aaron, I am completely with you, we NEED to sign Wood.