Jason,

I'd like to think you've come to know me as a HUGE fan, but one who doesn't drink koolaid; one who is level headed and realistic. With that being said, I would like to make a gentlemen's bet that by the end of the season, Lily has better numbers than Schmidt. Call it a hunch, call it a control pitcher who goes every 5th day and has a very good lineup behind him, but I call them like I see them. Or, we could bet a 6pack of our favorite libation? What say you?

Go Cubs !!!!!!!!!!

Jason,

I'd like to think you've come to know me as a HUGE fan, but one who doesn't drink koolaid; one who is level headed and realistic. With that being said, I would like to make a gentlemen's bet that by the end of the season, Lily has better numbers than Schmidt. Call it a hunch, call it a control pitcher who goes every 5th day and has a very good lineup behind him, but I call them like I see them. Or, we could bet a 6pack of our favorite libation? What say you?

Go Cubs !!!!!!!!!!

Jason B:

I believe you are correct. I know Lilly and Meche aren't the saviors but they are an upgrade. At least these guys should probably be able to go six or seven innings in the NL.

I agree that we need to add pitching and i am a diehard cub fan but i dont really know how lilly will work out. He is a flyball pitcher and that could cause problems at Wrigley. I hope we add Meche but i think the biggest signing would be an extension to big Z. That would give us a solid ace in Z and i think that eventually hill could be an ace giving us two in the same rotation. Kind of like when Wood and Prior carried close to World Series - - I pray to god without the injuries that Wood and Prior have. I guess i will not complain with any pitching to much so galde we atleast signed someone!

Jim (from TP),

I see that the Cubs signed Lily on foxsports.com as well...good news...now to add Meche.

I would have rather had Schmidt, if money was no object, but here is an angle where money may have been a big factor for Spendry: If Jim Hendry had bought Schmidt's services for $19 mill/yr, how much MORE would he have had to pay for Zambrano's extension???!?!?!

So it may be on purpose that the Cubs settled on 2nd Tier pitchers...

Rosenthal is reproting that Lilly is a Cub.

CUBS SIGN LILLY TO 4 YEAR DEAL

Austin,

I would love to get Penny, too, but after reading a report this morning out of the Chicago Tribune by Phil Rogers, I don't see Marmol going anywhere. Rogers said that the Cubs think if he can get his control issues behind him, that he could be as solid as they expect Hill to be for them. Maybe we could get him for JJ, Novoa, and Ryu.

If we could get Penny as a number 2 and put Meche at 3, to go with Zambrano, Hill, and maybe (keeping my fingers crossed) Prior, that would be the best rotation in the N.L. Central.

New reports from Rotoworld dont look good:

On Meche:

The Seattle Post-Intelligencer's John Hickey has revised his earlier report saying the Cubs would likely land Gil Meche. The Blue Jays yet remain in the running.

According to the new report, the Blue Jays thought they'd been beaten out by the Cubs, but 30 minutes after they heard that, the Jays reversed field and said their four-year, $40 million offer might yet prevail.

However, Pinella is confident, and many reports say the cubs are on the top of Meche's list.

They also say that Lilly wants to pitch for the Yankees, however, he is only waiting to see if they give him a decent offer, because he wants to sign somewhere in the next 24 hours, if not, he's a Cubs.

Since the Dodgers are looking for a corner outfielder and are shopping Penny, I would love to see a deal for him around JJ and Marmol...

I agree Aaron, Hendry is under pressure now to win. I'm sure that he will overpay on a trade or a free agent signing. Make no mistake, he has no choice. if the cubs aren't, at least, in the running at the end of this season. He is probably gone. Especially, if he spends all this money on these free agents and nothing comes of it. But, he will not count on the young pitchers in the farm system. We will get at least one more starting pitcher from somewhere and will overpay dearly for him. Either signing a 3rd rate started for first rate money or trading for multiple player. Its put up or shut up time for Hendry.

Rotoworld is now reporting that the Seattle Post says that Meche will likely join the Cubs and not the Jays. This would be good news.

Aaron, I agree with you about Miller ... I think he'll turn in a quality season and win 12-14 games, but I have to respectfully disagree with most of your other points. No way, no how, would you be able to get a top Dodger prospect, Humberto Sanchez, one of the young Pirate starters or Lowry for JJ. If he goes, JJ will go in a Sosa/Patteson type deal. As for your point about comparing our young pitchers to Santana, Schilling, Johnson and Mulder ... while it's true young pitchers take a few years to develop ... other than Guzman (pre-injury), our pitchers were not considered to be the same level of prospect as the pitchers you mentioned. I agree that some of our guys may improve, but unless Guzman turns things back around, we don't have a future #1 starter among our young pithers who played in the big leagues last season

I agree with you Aaron to a certain point - I'd like to sign one of the two though to reduce the question marks. I think we could go with a youngster in the #5 rotation spot without too much pain - and if he falters then we have other youngsters waiting for a shot. But last year we had ALL youngsters (and Z) and when some of them faltered (as is inevitable with inexperienced players) we were doomed. I'd like to go into spring training with 4 rotation spots spoken for and some competition for the 5 spot.

Am I the only one who sees a potentially huge deal the cubs could pull off? Everyone knows the hole in center is huge right now and what better way to fill it than with one of sweet Lou's old boys. Word is that the Devil Rays are shopping Baldelli who would be a stud in a Cubs uni. The guy's got speed, a glove, a pretty good OBP, and he has some pop in his bat, would look great in the #2 hole behind Soriano.

jerljr,

I totally agree with you. I don't want anyone that settled to come here. I would rather have a guy forced to come in a trade.

If the Cubs could get Zito I would be happy. I know he's a flyball pitcher but. its seems like the wind blows in more than blows out and as you all know, when that happens it take a Sammy Sosa special(corked bat) to get the ball out.

Plus he's has enough experience to know what to do on those days that its blowing out.

Any pitcher with a wicked curve ball like he has can pitch for me anyday.

What I worry about is all these pitchers that are talking to the Cubs seem to want to be somewhere else. If they dont get signed by the team they want to play for, they "settle" for the Cubs. We dont need a bunch of guys that don't want to be here. I would rather have a team of youngsters that do want to be here than that.

JJ is pretty much gone. I'll miss his production, but not his attitude. He was horrendous the first few months when we needed him most. What did he expect, a rousing ovation whenever he took the plate, or trotted out to right field? I say accomodate him, but only if you get value in return. I don't want any of this Sosa for nobody or Patterson for nobody sort of dump-off that Hendry had going with the Orioles. I'd prefer he be traded either for a pitcher, a top shortstop prospect, or top outfield prospect, and I definitely believe there is a market for him out there, especially with the Giants and possibly the Dodgers. The Dodgers have plenty of infield prospects, and I'm sure we could pry one or two away for Jones.

As for Schmidt, I couldn't agree with you more Anthony---good for definitely this year, but what about the last two of his contract? Plus, the guy wanted to stay on the coast, so that wouldn't have happened anyway. Zito won't come here, and Boras probably told him to tell people he'd be willing to play for Ron Washington in Texas and for Piniella with the Cubs, just to drive up his asking price. That guy is a tremendous little rat, but he does a great job at what he does, I must say....but Zito is going to NY, that is, unless we lose out on Lilly AND Meche, and vastly overpay for Zito because he's all that's left. Also, as Anthony just mentioned, Miller is still in the fold. Everyone seems to have ignored the guy, and he came all the way back to make some pretty quality starts for the Cubs, and we got him on the cheap for about 1.5 million. Zambrano, Hill, Miller, Cotts/Prior?, and you fill in with someone from last year like Marshall/Mateo/Marmol/Ryu/Guzman, or go for a completely unproven in Veal or Gallagher for the 5th spot.

I think Hendry's trade for Cotts was more proactive than anything, in case we lost out on any of the targeted free agents. With Eyre and Ohman in the bullpen, it really didn't make all that much sense at the time, but I really think Hendry wants to give him every opportunity to earn a spot in the rotation.

As for trades, Jennings would probably cost too much, unless we got a third team involved and included Cedeno in that trade, and Westbrook is not on the block, so we might be left with maybe Noah Lowry from the Giants, or prospects from the Dodgers for JJ. If I were Hendry, there's no way I'm trading anymore pitching prospects in case we need them for injury call-ups. I'd trade Novoa, Cotts, Wuertz, Cedeno, Prior, and Theriot before I ever entertained offers for our other pitching prospects. All the guys we had up last year have a great chance of being in a major league rotation somewhere, maybe even next year with all the experience they got. Guzman has great stuff and gets strikeouts, but he needs better coaching. Ryu throws a lot of ground balls, and gets strikeouts. Marshall has great poise, and until his injury, looked like he'd be a lock for next year. Mateo seemed to have good command, until he also got a little banged up. And we all know that Marmol has amazing movement on his pitches----seems a lot like Zambrano when he first came up, but has trouble locating pitches, leading to his high pitch counts, and quick exits from games. The thing people don't realize is that we have enough young talent where at least one or two of them I believe will definitely pan out for the rotation, so we don't absolutely have to have a Lilly or Meche. Now, would it be wise to not go after at least one of them? No, of course not...All I'm saying is if for whatever reason both of them spurn the Cubs, or their asking price is ridiculous---we DO have options...plenty of them. Furthermore, you also have Veal and Gallagher that many scouts feel are ready.

Keep in mind that a lot of pitchers don't find their groove until their second or third full season, and usually the ones that do find it their first season, with a few exceptions (Clemens, Zito, Willis) suffer dropoffs the next year. I'm confident that all of them will have dramatic improvements next year barring injury. Remember, Santana, Johnson, Schilling, and, Mulder, all had a similar beginning to what our pitchers did last year. Santana's ERA was in the 6.40 range, while Schilling was in the 6-9.00 range, and Mulder was in the 5.50 range. All of them bounced back in the next full season or two to become some of the most dominant pitchers we've seen. So is everyone that ready to give the 4 and 5 spots (assuming #3 goes to Miller) to Meche and Lilly 4.65 ERA and 4.60 ERA averages, respectively? In the last 3 yrs, Meche has had 2 seasons over 5.00 ERA, and Lilly laid an egg in '05 with a 5.56 ERA. Are they honestly worth $10 million a year for that? True, experience is worth something, and yes, they did pitch in the AL which elevates their stats a bit, but both led their respective teams in walks, which is never a good thing considering our problems last year, AND they were both, at best, their team's third best pitchers with ERA's hovering in the mid 4.00 range.

Therefore, with Zambrano, Hill, and hopefully Miller/Prior, garnering the 1-3 spots in the rotation, Lilly and Meche would be 4 and 5, and with their numbers, couldn't we find at least 2 out of our young pitchers to equal, if not best those stats? If anything, we could trade JJ for a young Pirates pitcher, or the Giants for Lowry, or even the Yankees in a package for Humberto Sanchez.

Unfortunately for Hendry, everyone is so worried about ensuring we win it all next year, that he's backed into a corner, and must overpay just to say he did something at the very least. My guess is we might end up with Mulder in an incentive-laden deal, and maybe go after Jeff Weaver if Lilly and Meche spurn us for the Yankees or Blue Jays, respectively. But I'd say to Hendry, and to all of you.....it is NOT the end of the world if they do so, because we definitely have the talent, and now we have a lineup actually capable of scoring some runs for these guys, and will reduce a lot of the pressure they had last year to perform.

Does anyone else agree with me?

According to the CArdinals the Scmidt deal is not done yet. Schmidt's agent the Cardinals that there was not a deal done yet. As of 4:30

I'd bet Hendry's "big" bat is Floyd ... though I wouldn't necessarily call that a big bat. Like Trevor and Nat, I'm also getting worried that Lily goes to NY and Meche to Tor. No way we get Zito. We may end up with a bunch of holes in the rotation.

Who could be the left handed bat. Floyd??? Wouldn't it have to be in a trade since there's not, what I would call, a big left-handed bat on the free agent market.

Ryan church reminds me of Mabry

Jeff in AZ - I hope that "big" left handed bat is not in the form of Ryan Church which I have read many rumors about today.

I think that we end up trading for Westbrook or Jennings. I hope we get Meche instead of Lilly but I hope we don't leave the meetings without atleast one solid starter. I hope we do something soon. Things are moving much faster this offseason compared to the last couple.

If you strikeout on both of these guys, than you have to throw money at Zito and offer up some prospects for jennings or Westbrook. But, first lets see how all of this plays out, I read on ESPN that the Yankees interest is luke warm with Lilly, so he may only have the Cubs. It sounds like Lilly would prefer to go back to the Yanks, but he may have no choice but put on blue pinstipes instead of black. No worries though, he will love playing in Wrigley and for the new Cubs. Side note, Lilly's agent Obrien was told by Hendry that the Cubs are planning on adding a "big" left handed bat.

Nathanael this is what I was worried about last night. It's no surprise that the Yanks are involved and Lily did pitch for them in the past so that has to be in his mind. He's most likely happy with what the Cubs offered, but wants to see if the Yanks are going to flop a fistful of dollars at him like they have other pitchers in the past.

Meche is leaning towards Toronto? C'mon Lou, I thought he was your boy!

I'm starting to get worried. I just read on ESPN that Meche is leaning toward Toronto over the Cubs. Also, it sounds like if the Yankees want Lilly, he's going to go to them. So there's a chance we completely strike out. I wonder if Hendry would think about Zito then? Or what would he do if we get neither of those guys? I hope we get both.

Jason, I really like the Penny idea, and I would prefer JJ to a super-aging Luis Gonzales. He has been a nice player most of his career, but I think JJ would be more productive.

I was down on Meche myself, but when I looked at his numbers, I started to turn. Then I heard from multiple sources that he could be on the verge of erupting into a huge pitcher, so four years at $35 million, I am down with that.

To be redundant and as everyone else has mentioned, the most satisfying thing is that we are not relying on Prior and Wood and if Prior returns to form, IF, I said, IF, well, you have a number 1 starter in Z and 1A in Prior. Granted I understand that is a huge if, but it would be a great problem to have too many pitchers.

Anthony, I am thinking, I am thinking that April 2nd in Cincinnati cannot come soon enough.

? For a second there I thought this was a Dodger forum. lol

I really believe that if there were a couple "no brainers" in this years FA pool, Hendry would be doing everything in his power to get them. Zito you say? Sure, but I really don't believe he wanted to come to Chicago. Schmidt? Schmidt is surely on the backside of his career and has lost a lot of velocity. I have a feeling he will pitch good next year, but what about the next few years? I was dead against Lily and Meche until I looked at the numbers. First off, when comparing their ERA's, please remember these 2 pitch in the AL, which does make a difference. Lily's numbers look more consistent than Meche's, but most pundits agree that Meche can be a special pitcher.

I really think these 2 will add value to the Cubs pitching staff, which will be anchored by Big Z. They are HEALTHY and could easly (not wishful thinking) give the Cubs 13 + victories each.

I think Hendry knows he can't risk WAITING. I would have loved to get Jennings or Westbrook, but trades may never happen, even if Hendry offers comprable value. And who's the say we still can't go after Jennings anyway?

I'm also one of those believers that Wade Miller will return to decent form this year. I'm not saying we'll see the sub 4.00 ERA guy from the past, but he will do much better than people expect. Then, there's the wildcard in Prior. The best thing is, we're not counting on him, but he could come in and put us over the top.

Just think Cubs fans.

Cubs will sign one pitcher or the other but not both. Then they'll probably trade for another. I still think they could do with at least one more bat. A good situation hitter to bat behind or in front of Soriano. I still would love to have Lofton. SPARKPLUG, THEY NEED A SPARKPLUG!!!!!

I'd love to see Penny in a Cub uniform, but it looks like LA will sign Gonzales to play the OF so they won't want JJ. The Dodgers should have a pretty good team next year and their farm system is loaded ... Colleti has done a great job over there. My guess is that they will either keep Penny or try to use him in a deal with top tier prospects for a big power guy like Manny or Sexson (and move Nomar to LF or 3B if its Sexson).

Sorry Guys,

I"M EXCITED, by bad.....Lilly and Meche!

Austin,

Right on!! I'm with you, Gill and Meche will be fine here in Chi-town. 15.6 million a year for Schmidt is WAY too much. He's 33 and who know if he's 100% plus he's a California Girl...that's just too much for him. He's NOT worth that; AND most of all....he's NOT a Cardinal!

Just read on ESPN that the Cubs are "closing in on a deal with Meche, 4 yrs around 35 million..."

Zambrano

Lilly

Hill

Meche

Prior/Miller

not bad...

I just read Lilly has ruled out Toronto. It's down to the Cubs and the Yankees. Go get him, Spendry!!

Anyone for a game of dominoes? :-) I'd be willing to bet that we know where Lilly and Meche end up by the end of the day.

Every team that just lost out on Schmidt will turn to the remaining pitchers. The dominoes will start to fall quickly I believe. Boras will send Zito the Yanks, and that leaves Lily and Meche. Let's see how quickly Hendry reacts to the upcoming dogfight. (Or perhaps its Lou that is sealing the deals nowadays..)

Can't blame this one on Hendry - he had said all along that he preferred to stay on the west coast and for a while it seemed Hendry recognized it might take a little more $$$ to get him to come to the midwest... but if the numbers reported are right then it would have taken $19 a year over 3... and that would have been too high even for this offseason.

But I have to say I'm happy in 2 ways over this - 1) the guy is getting to play where he wanted - the west coast and 2) he's NOT going to the Cards :-)

How about any Cubs rumblings or rumors. It has been quiet all day, either something big is brewing, or the dominoes will start falling now that Schmidt has been signed.

I read the Schmidt signing may free up Brad Penny to be traded for a bat.

The Dodgers just lost left-handed JD Drew...how about Jacque Jones and some pitching prospects for Brad Penny???!