Dick/Austin,

You are right...there has not been an official quote from Jacque Jones, in which he requests a trade. However, in Paul Sullivan's column, he points to comments Jacque has made, and hints at his inside knowledge and makes it sound like a fact that Jacque has asked out.

Here is the link:

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-061205cubs,1,1563825.story?coll=cs-cubs-headlines

Both Jacque and Hendry are quoted in there, and neither flatly deny that Jones wants out, and Hendry states that he would move guys that want to be moved.

They are skirting the issue here. If there was no fact to this rumor, there would have been self-righteous indignation and chest-pounding by both Hendry and Jones...instead, they are both just not denying anything.

It is quite possible that Hendry/Piniella are able to talk with Jones and get him to commit to playing in Cubbie Blue, and that they decide to put him in CF. If Pie does well, they can then dump Jacque at any time. So keeping Jones may very well turn out to be a safety net.

I had hoped that Pierre would have been convinced to stick around, but because of Pie, Hendry had no interest in pursuing him, which I think is a shame. What a waste to sign Pierre at the expense of all those prospects, and to have nothing to show for it. I am all for using prospects as trade fodder, but the return on our investment in the Pierre deal was short-lived.

Jim B,

I know it was rumored that he asked for a trade, but cubs.com actually denied that...so who knows.

With that being said, if he is willing to stay, i think it is the BEST OPTION, not most likely...

GGOOOOO Aaron! Men I hate long post, but I have to tell you this was worth it! Right on the money with Corey. I'd love to have him back but the O's won't be as Dumb. Totally right about the ridiculous intentions of making him a slap hitter and expecting a #6 hitter to lead-off just bc his got speed. PEOPLE remember this when dreaming of taking Soriano away of the lead-off spot. Let players do what got them in the Bigs.

Also I have to agree with Anthony that Corey needed time away of a hostile environment created solely by the coaching staff. If it's true JJ wants out, well let him go but no Church or Finley..let Pie/Pagan try out in spring.

Anyway just wanted to tell the CCO family that they rock! And that this is a site were friendly debates roll with very intelligent analysis…I applaud it. To me this is more like group therapy for the faithfull yearly post-regular season depressions. You let me know I'm not alone out there men. I love you and it's easier to deal with life having this great therapy companions. Woohuu I love you again wohuuu!

Saddly and probably we shall cry again the magic words at the end of next season….MAYBE NEXT YEAR!! JAJAJAJA seeya

I can't believe everyone wants Patterson back, or Erstad, or whoever.

1) Jones has not requested a trader per cubs.com

2) Jones came up a centerfielder and can play it. yes, his arm is weak, but all around he is much better than anyone else we can get.

3) Baldelli, Crawford, and top players are pipedreams. Ain't gonna happen

Jones is our best chance to WIN. Piniella recently said he was our #5 hitter. If the fans quit booing him, he'll be fine.

Also, if the Cubs really were planning on moving him, don't you think they could have come up with $8 million for Lofton after spending so much already. He was probably the best option for us and settled for a one-year contract (works for Pie).

The best solution to CF is right under our nose.

My Mother has a cannon arm compared to Jones.... sorry if I offended you Mom. : )

GGGOooooo Aaron! I have to tel you, I hate reading long posts but say no more, this one felt profesional. Right on the money with Corey. While he would be an upgrade over JJ I don't see Baltimore doing the same mistake the Cubs did when they gave up on him. I also have to agree with Anthony that he needed time away from a hostile Wrigley enviroment created because of ridiculous coaching trying to make him a slap hitter. I would love to have him back though.

Also I wanted to applaud the fact that CCO is the coolest cubs site because of its writers and also lots of smart analisys and friendly debates on our lovable loosers...Yeah this is like group therapy on a lost cause., still you guys giveme hope but if I would have to bet 100grand I'd @ the end of next year we shall be saying the magic words

OOOOOuuh Maybe Next Year!!! Go CCO!

Patterson also has a cannon for a arm compared to

Jones.

Joe/Austin,

From all accounts, Jacque Jones asked for a trade. He doesn't want to be on the team. He had decent (but not great) stats for a corner OF. He strikes out too much, and his arm was horrible. All in all, he was better than Burnitz and Hollandsworth...but is that really saying much? Bottomline is still that he asked for a trade, and Hendry is going to get rid of a guy that doesn't want to be here.

It is important to have strong defense up the middle...SS/2B/CF. If you are strong defensively in those positions, your pitchers are going to look good, give up less runs, get out of more jams, and throw less pitches. That is due to more double-plays, and less runners testing the CF's arm on sac flies or on singles with a man on 1st, etc...

Aaron,

Good call on the Cubs not thinking outside the box with Patterson, and trying to make him into something he is not. If you think about it, Patterson is really a quicker version of Jacque Jones, with a stronger arm. They both have mid-20's HR power, they both have consistently hit in .250-.270 range, they both strike out a lot, they are both left-handed, and they both got booed like hell at Wrigley. Despite as bad as he did in 2006 (under the Dusty Bunch that preached swinging at everything) I would take him back now. I believe with the proper coaching (not messing with his swing...simply helping with strikezone selection) he would consistently hit .280 with 25 HRs. But, unlike Jones, he could also get you 30 stolen bases. Maybe in a few years, after his brother Eric takes over 2B, we will catch a mature Corey Patterson as a free agent, and the two brothers will wind up playing together at Wrigley.

Who knows...could happen.

I wish we would have signed Lofton. I think he would have been the perfect stopgap/lead-in for Pie. I am still unsure what the heck Trader Jim is going to do about CF now! So my guess is that it will be something we weren't expecting at all.

Stay tuned, CCO Readers!

Aaron,

Surely no offense taken. Corey's stats can be explained in a number of ways, but when you look at the bottom line, he's a career .256 hitter. That isn't even what I wanted to point out, it was that Corey had to go, bc of everything that had happened. And, if he came back and got off to a cold start, I would almost guarantee that he COULD NOT turn it around here. He is way too risky, there would be way too much pressure on him.

Like you though, I'm very interested to see what he will do this year. His average dropped quite a bit in the 2nd half last year and I'll be interested to see if he gets back on track and takes the next step , or if he remains an underachiever with good speed. Believe it or not, I really hope he does well.

Anthony...no offense man, but are you serious about Patterson's stats? For one, in '00 and '01, he was shuttled between the IA Cubs and the big club, so you can't count that, just as you wouldn't for, oh, say, Buck Coats, or someone like that that only gets 100 at bats as a call up. '02 was his first year, and he started to show some life, though his OBP was low, but you could tell he was starting to figure things out, much like almost all players do in their first full season...Then, '03 he has a break-out year, and everyone finally realizes his potential, then tears his ACL...'04, he comes back and does a pretty good job, though his OBP and avg drop about 20 points each from the year before---but, that's to be expected when you come back from an injury and try to get back in the swing of things, but the Cubs were trying to make him into something he wasn't----a leadoff hitter. He's a middle of the order guy that happens to have speed. In '05 they majorly jacked with his swing in attempts to make him into a slap hitter, and then they sent him back to square one, where he's flailing at every pitch...'06 the O's let him do what he's comfortable with, and his numbers go up to what they were in '04...See a trend here? I think he's going to have a breakout year next year, with about 28 hr, 95 rbi with a .285-.290 avg...which is not bad at all for a middle of the order guy.

It's so unfortunate that you have guys like Baylor who are so negative toward you (though intentions are good)---but totally wreck your confidence, then you have a guy like Baker come in, who let's players be pretty much, and can't be critical of his players at all---so you're left out in the cold---magically, you have a breakout season in '03 when everyone's left you alone, then you unfortunately get hurt, hustling out a ground ball (which not too many players do these days), then he comes back to have a decent year 24 hr, 72 rbi, and the coaching staff comes down on him (probably ordered from the top w/ MacFAIL and Jimbo) wanting him to be a top of the order guy when he should've been moved to RF in place of Sosa, and they should've signed someone like Lofton to play CF. Unfortunately, the Cubs were going by tradition in baseball where your fastest guy is the CF and he leads off, rather than thinking outside of the box, and putting him in LF or RF instead where there were openings created by the voids left by Alou and Sosa....then, to make matters worse, he has a coaching staff that doesn't stick by him and tell everyone, "look, be patient with Corey, we totally F****D up his swing....so it'll take a little time to get it back to what it was before"....'05 was a wasted season anyway, and the Cubs didn't make any significant additions for '06 other than JJ, Eyre and Howry....so unless you trade him for a stud prospect CF or for a serviceable major league one, you keep him, and let him go back to the basics....But no, we let him go for peanuts and cracker jacks----even offering him arbitration before we did so. Does that make any sense at all?

Anyway, I'm just ashamed that we didn't give him a chance to go back to what he was doing, which is a .270-.290 avg 25 hr, 75-? rbi's and .320 OBP....That OBP is not leadoff worthy, but it sure is close to JJ's .330 OBP, and Patterson has more speed and a far better arm. Would it have been so terrible to switch him to the corner outfield spot, and watch him grow as a player...Who knows, with the right coaches---like Piniella and Perry, he might be a .300 hitter 30 hr 100 rbi with .340 OBP...But we'll never know. I do think it'd be wise to at least trade JJ for him, and include some pitching prospects for him. He had like 45 steals, and he's still only 27 years old. I think his stats in '03, '04, and '06 definitely show that he's on the verge of putting it all together. Luis Gonzalez didn't start putting it together until he was 30, and he didn't have near the tools that Patterson has. I think it's a shame that people were so ready to write him off that early. They often confuse '00 and '01 as full season....even '03. But in reality, he only had '02, '04, and '05 with us. '04 was a solid year and '02 was his first full year, and '05, Baker's joke of a coaching staff tried to change him...so take all those factors into consideration before you rush to judgement. He was a fine player for us, and WILL be a great player someday...that I'm sure of, and you can tell that by his numbers last year, where is avg went up, stolen bases went up, and strikeouts went down considerably.

I would only agree to that if his shoulder is better. If not more people will run on him than they did Pierre.

The overwhelming response is that we should get rid of Jacque Jones. I'm just not convinced that the Cubs will be better off without him. With Kenny Lofton off the market, there really is no good options for the centerfield positIon. I think Jones should at least be given the chance to show he can't play out there. I know it has been reported that he is not happy, but I believe that sweet Lou could probably smooth all that over. If the plan is to give Pie another year in the minors than Jones is definitely our best option right now.

First of all, Bernie Williams is not an option because he said that if the Yankees wouldn't sign him, he would probably retire.

I don't think Finley would be a great option either, Jim hit the nail on the head here. Pagan is just as capable of putting up a sub .250 average, but he could definately do better. Why sign Finley when all we care about is defense when we have an in-house option in Pagan?? Pagan can run too!

I still think the best option would be to put Jones in the middle of Murton and Soriano in the outfield. That way, we would have a CF who can field, but even better, we wouldn't lose his bat in the lineup.

I don't see the sense in trading Jones for a CF or spending money for a one year guy...let's just try it with Jones for at least the first half, and if we are competitive, then we shoudl consider making some moves. If we suck again, we can start again with Pie in 2008.

Did someone say bring Corey Patterson back ? I honestly think some of us only remember in 03' when Corey came out like a man possessed. What about ALL the other years, 00' 01', 02' 04', 05' ? One good half season and at least 3 and a half really bad seasons. As far as him doing poorly as a lead-off hitter, it was only in 05' when he was forced to play bat lead-off all season. He batted in almost every other slot the other years. His HYPE was much worse than his BITE if you really look at it. There are some fans pointing to Corey's numbers last year while they are pining for him. He put up numbers worse than Jacque Jones.

Lastly, I was not one of the fans running him out of town, but the reality is, it was the best thing for him and this organization after all that had happened.

I wish him the best of luck, but I say we stick to guys that will actually be available rather than dream of what could have been.

Jon;

I like the way you are thinking. CF is definitely the last most important move for the Cub. Freel would complete and balance the line-up with a scrappy productive-at-bat pirahna Eckstein type player that the Cubs never seem to value much. A player like him makes a lot of sense as a replacement for Jones. With the tall timber they have he is someone who can bat 2 and frustrate good pitchers in a tight ballgame and even run a bit. Having said that, I doubt the Reds want to give him up nor help the Cub. Also Church is the more likely trade for Hendry, I believe.

I like the Houston move for Jennings if they sign him. The Cub should have made this 3.7 something ERA guy a target to keep him from Houston and create a solid 1-4 in their rotation, even if it meant giving top prospects. Now you have Marquis, a real high risk very high beta guy blocking a spot for three years for the very prospects (Marshall, Marmol) that could have been used to acquire a very solid, durable proven and reliable young pitcher for many years to come. And if Marquis does continue to tank as he did in 06 its lost money as no team will accept the contract in trade...sounds then like two years of being "stuck". Finally, this move likely requires the belief that Prior will return to form to give anyone a good feeling that the Cub wil be better than .500 in 07 as the rotation is so-so if everything goes as expected.

Jon like that idea. He one of those guys who just hustles every play. Depending on the cost I would definetly make that deal. Can never have to many of those guys in the clubhouse.

Well, first: Who do I think will man center field next year? I think it will end up being Pie. I'm not sure that's a good idea in terms of his development (we can survive a horrible season as a team so that's not my concern), but I think that's what it will be.

"Who do I want in center?" What I do NOT want to happen is to trade good players for a one year rental like we did with Pierre. Pretty much everybody seems to think the job is Pie's in '08, and that's fine. Let's sign a mediocre FA for one year and a little bit of money to keep the spot warm for him, or trade low-level talent for an average outfield prospect if one is available. Both of these options would also allow Pagan to get some regular playing time rather than being a strict backup, which I think will help him at the plate.

In the "won't happen and would probably cost too much" derby, what do you guys think it would take to pry Ryan Freel from the Reds? They signed Gonzalez at SS, it's Phillips' job to lose at 2B, they seem content with Encarnacion at 3B and Hatteberg at 1B and they have a number of good, young catchers. My point is, they don't seem to have a set place for him to play until Griffey inevitably gets injured. Are they still looking for bullpen help? Would they take Jones for RF in exchange for Freel?

I recall reading once that Freel says his ideal position is "Griffey's spot," meaning center. I would love to have him man center for us this year, then let him compete for any openings (if, say, DeRosa sucks at second this year) or be a super-utility guy for us in '08. He bats around .275, which is pretty good, but most important he's one of those guys who makes things happen once he gets on base. The last three seasons, he has averaged 37 steals a year while playing an average of 126 games.

I suppose, depending on the cost, that's what I'd like to see.

Worse than .246 avg. 6 HR's and 40 RBI's in 426 at bats. I don't think that would happen. Finley is too much of a gamble to use up the roster spot. I would rather have Jones in center or Pie. I was thinking about maybe Bernie Williams but his shoulder is to iffy. I say take a gamble and have Pie and Pagan battle it out. Trade Jones for a top prospect and then win the world series in 5 games. Easy as that. Right?????

Jim,

Yes Pagan could do just as good, he also could do worse. They need something to fall back on. Plus, they need guys on the team that know how to win.

Why sign Finley when you have Pagan. Pagan could do the same job as Finley and probaly better. Its time for Finley to retire. I don't see how this would make sence. Pagan is unproven but given the chance could easily put up a .246 avg. 6 HR's and 40 RBI's (finley's 06 #'s) which was up from .222 in 05. Yes he is good defensively but can't that be said of Pagan.

I say play trade Jones and Ohman for prospects and play Pagan in CF, he doesn't need to hit, just field.

Soriano

Izturis

Lee

Ramirez

Barrett

Murton

DeRosa

Pagan

Zambrano

still a ton of thunder to that lineup

Meh, I don't mind the PSD forums, if anybody gives me crap I just tell them why they're retarded and completely own them, because they have the collected IQ of 5 there.

Anywho, CF issues -

Rowand - No. Not available. Righty..

Baldelli - Who?

2B Issue Giles - Downside of his career. We are paying DeRosa a lot of money to play...

More CF issues...

Mike Cameron might be an available option...

My thoughts exactly,geen. Some of the people on here will disagree with you though. Finley is lacking some luster at the plate but has knowledge that could help Pie. Actually I was thinking of maybe platooning Finley and Pie. Pagan then becomes the odd man out,I would like the power of Floyd but he couldn't do much in center for us. Like I said before Finley would be a cheap plug in center for 07'.

If a veteran like Steve Finley is available and willing to sign for $1-2 million a year, I am all for it. Pie can still have a shot to win the job and if so, Finley is a great option off the bench and to spell the outfielders. He may have lost his bat, but he can still run pretty darn well and if Pie does not pan out, you have great insurance in Finley.

If that is the rumor, then I support it.

If the rumor of signing Finley pans out I would think that the cubs would use him for late innning defense and a back up to letting Jones Pagan or Pie have a shot playing CF this spring. Just insurance so you had someone that could play the position at even if he is done producing at the plate.

I really like the idea of getting Patterson back. I was one of the few that didn't want him to leave. You can't force someone to be a leadoff hitter just becasue they have speed. But if we got Patterson back that would block Pie and then we would have Soriano, Murton, Pie, Patterson and Pagan. Don't see that happening. Think if we never traded him away. No Pierre and would have three pitchers back. OH Well. Co Cubs

Up with the CCO and down with PSD forums. Those people on there are ass#$les. They seem to think tha they know so much more than everyone else and when someone posts for the first time they dog the person.

Just saying thank God, Allah, Budda etc.. for the CCO. Neil and the rest do a great job and should be proud of themselves.

I hope that we can get a good outfielder through trade but if not, I think they should give Pie a chance. He may not be completely ready yet but look who he has around him to teach him. You learn from the vets and the stars. The way I see it is if he wants to take the next step, he'll be a good student this year. Who knows, maybe he would learn fast and prove us all wrong. GO CUBS!!!

A few thoughts....

* I would reacquire Patterson if he became available. Now that Baltimore has Payton he just might be.

* I would love to see the Cubs get Crawford and Baldelli. Of course they would have to deal Murton, Pie, Izturis or Cedeno, Marshall and probaly Hill.

* I think Jones will be eventually be dealt and I think he will end up back in Minnesota.

Great comments guys. With Murton, there would be no way I would give him up, he has hit at every level of the minors and prooved he can hit the majors, the home runs will come.

As for CF if we can't make a trade or grab a FA, I think Jones and Pagan could at least get us to the trade deadline. But I do love the idea of Rowand in center. I wonder if anything is up Hendry's sleeve? Go Cubs

Jeff (in AZ),

No idea how you posted a reply to post that didn't yet exist, but job well done. If you normally see into the future, can you please let us all know if Prior's shoulder will hold up in '07? Thanks!

Lots of great posts and ideas, and I can't respond to all of them, but here are some quick thoughts:

Getting a young CF in a trade won't likely happen, as we have a young CF in Pie in the wings, and Hendry won't block his path.

Jones did put up good numbers, but he doesn't want to be here, and his defense won't be missed. His offense won't really be missed either, as Lee will be healthy and Soriano has much more power than Jones anyway, and Murton should also show improvement in the power category. If we do pick up Cliff Floyd, that is even more power added to the OF. So don't sweat Jones...he is as good as gone. I put the over/under on prospect we acquire for him at 2.

Finally: I always liked Marcus Giles, and would MUCH rather have him than DeRosa. If Giles wants to be in SanDiego, then it doesn't matter. But if Jim Spendry can pick him up, he should. I don't care what has been promised to DeRosa, as he is a career backup anyway. If you were stuck with Jason Bere, and then Jason Schmidt became available, you would definitely take the better of the two Jasons, right? Same thing here...pick up Giles!

Unfortunately, that is what I want, but I do not believe it will happen. Oh well.

I still think the best move, with Lofton off the table, is to let Pie win the job in Spring Training.

Hey...how about we reacquire Corey Patterson?

Jim, I've been to those threads and they are truly bad. The ugly self righteous banter is way worse than anything I've EVER seen on here. One of the number one reasons to come to CCO, thoughtful debate.

Jim - I agree complete about the PSD forums - I love how the site links to all the relevant news articles and I visit it daily, but the forums are one of the more hostile places I've seen online (well... for baseball discussions anyway)

As for the CF option, I hear a rumor (take it for what its worth since I have no link) that the Cubbies were close to signing Finley for $1-2 mil a year. Personally I don't have a problem with that - his bat is below average anymore, but his defense is still above average and with the other bangers in the lineup, I'd rather have an asset on defense than a weak fielder that can hit.

Of course it'd be nice to have both, but if all we're looking for at this point is a stopgap until Pie (or Paterson - they're giving him time in CF as well as 2B) is ready, then a cheap defensive-minded player sounds like the right way to go. I'd rather that than trade away prospects for a solution.

Defense up the middle and offense up the lines - that's a good recipe for success :-)

I think they should go after Erstad if they need someone for one year. He is in the same mold of Rowand as far as hustle and playing hard, he is left handed and is a great clubhouse leader. Personally I would go with Pie. The lineup is strong enough to allow him to develope. If it turns out he is not going to make the grade the Free agent market for CF next year is outstanding

I Agree with you...what makes Murton so special is that he is a disiplined hitter and not worried of taking strike two if he thinks he can get a base. If you know baseball, you have to expect Murton to be in the 25-30 hr this year and an average around .300 This was the only good thing we got out of the Nomar trade and believe me that epstein[bo sox] tried to convince JH to give him back. He was with out a question one of our top 3 guys last year and was able to pull it of with the stupidity of Baker having him platooned. Men I'm so glad Dusty is out and that the players that deserve a chance will have constant at bats. With the exception of Cedeno; some times rookies need to have a sense of security and need to feel that in order to relax and performed. I totally blame Dusty for the one month slump Murton had, however his abilities led him to a strong finish.

As for Pagan some times you like a player and others you don't. If push comes to shove and he gets the chance to play on a daily basis you will understand the versatility and abuility this guy has. He is more than a 4th OF but If the Cubs get a Rowand I would not object. I would keep Jones specially bc he seems humble and anyway he is paid to play baseball and he did that better than most on our Cubs team last year. I don't care as long as you put the numbers up there I would't mind having Barry Bonds. I hope we keep Jones, As for Felix Pie's numbers I think he still has a lot to proove at a minor league level. No doubt in my mind he will be good though other teams do not give him the highest ranking a prospect can have. There are a lot of prospects ranked higher than him that still have to get experience...not everybody is Andrew Jones playing good in the MLB since age 19.

Atlanta cut ties with Marcus Giles.

Now there is a guy definitely worth going for. Hes had an .OBP upwards of .350, and and avg above .290 for much of his career.

couple of comments guys:

-no chance in hell we get Baldelli---too many other teams have better prospects/players to offer than we do.

-Gathright? We're better off putting Pie or Pagan out there. Gathright's another version of Neifi Perez to me, but with incredible speed...oh, and he hits like .240 if that

-Rowand? Not a chance that happens unless he requests a trade, or Philly is blown away by an offer. They love the hustle of the guy....Also, like Baldelli, too many other teams want him

-As for Giles comments...no way that happens either, as we have plenty of talent at 2B now, or emerging in DeRosa, Patterson, Theriot, Cedeno. Plus, he wants to play in SD with Brian

-Finley's finished, and I think was in all probability a product of some performance enhancing when he was producing....much like Gonzo--his teammate, probably was too. But Finley's far past being productive at this stage in his career anyway

-As for Wilson...I love that idea. I've been a fan of him since he was with the Pirates and when Lee went down I'd hoped we'd make a run for him. He has good power, and a decent arm for the OF. However, if I were a betting man, I'd say Hendry's going with Floyd to get yet another lefty bat.

-Jones is as good as gone, but I think the Cubs might wait til spring to trade him, and if they don't, then he's the CF by default and they probably couldn't get anything decent for him

-On a side note, and I mentioned this yesterday....With Ankiel being non-tendered, I think we should make a run at him. He has a great arm for the outfield, as he was a former pitcher. He had like 22 hr, 75 rbi in lik 120 games in '05 in the minors, and he hit at the major league level when he was pitching, so we'd know what we'd be getting....I definitely think he's worth the risk. Even when he was pitching, everyone was raving what a phenomenal athlete he was, so I definitely think it's worth a shot...plus, he's a lefty bat. Who knows? I'd love to see us sign him just to stick it to the Cards...wouldn't you?

If we're trying to find a one year CF for rent. Why not Bernie Williams, he's a proven winner and could show PIE some things. Probaly won't happen, PIE will more than likely get the chance..

Nat is right. The Rays supposedly turned down Kyle Davies, Saltalamacchia, and Yunel Escobar ... we don't have a package which could beat that unless you deal Hill and Pie together (which would be a mistake). Thus, although he'd look great in a Cub uniform, Baldelli is not an option.

Do any of you guys/gals go to ProSportsDaily.com threads? Those people are ass's. They act as if they are the smartest people in the world and feel that they have some sort of problem with people posting there own ideas. What a awful place for fans.

Mark,

"Murton though good has no power and is showing no signs of getting any, corner outfielders need to have power and i don';t know if it's prudent to keep him, his defense is average at best with no arm."

How do you come to this conclusion. I saw huge potential from a guy who was in his first season in left. I saw a great arm, but was adjusting to playing at Wrigley. He had the highest batting average on the team. You can teach a guy to play the field and hit for power but you can't teach a guy to hit .300. If you take all of his at bats form 05 and 06 it is a full season of at bats and he had 20 HR's and 76 RBI's. No power???? This guy has more potential and talent than anyone on the team. You are way off.

Mark, how do you propose that we trade for Baldelli? I don't think we have what they would want...in our whole farm system (unless we're willing to think about trading Hill, which I hope we're not).

the problem with Jones playing center is he is not a center fielder, we will suffer defensively, sori is still learning the outfield position and will hopefully get better but right now is just average in the outfield, runners will not run on him as much this year because he has such a good arm therefore his assist will go down. Pie is not ready and may not be major league stuff???? his stats to me are not all that impresive compared to most of the sucessful center fielders in their minor league years. If we trade for a center fielder do we trade for a one year stop gag which lofton was about the only one worth having and he is now gone, or do we trade for a real center fielder and give up on pie. I don't know what the answer is, I would probably be forced to trade for baldelli and play him in center, then trade jones with a reliever and a prospect for another decent 3 or 4 hole pictcher, then next year keep baldelli, he is tied up through the 2011 season, and keep him in center, next year possibly trade murton, and if pie is really ready put him in left or put him in center and baldelli in left. Murton though good has no power and is showing no signs of getting any, corner outfielders need to have power and i don';t know if it's prudent to keep him, his defense is average at best with no arm. the question is do you throw away a year waiting on pie to develop and may still not have anything, or do you go after a decent player that can help you now and in the future??? there aren't any other options available that i see. That was a good post and very thought provoking. keep up the good work

The Phillies have now said that Roward is not available. The Sox wanted him for Garcia, but the Phils would not include him in the deal. Sure, they'd deal him if you overwhelmed them with a package, but no way would you get it done for Jones (or by adding Cedeno, Theriot, and/or marginal prospects).

I don't know why everyone wants to throw away 27 home runs from the left side so readily when we need lefty bats. Piniella recently said he has Jones in the five hole. Jones came up as a CF and has good range.

I don't think we will get anyone better than Jones, and I hope we give him the chance in CF.

Imagine if he was on another team. Everyone would list him as a our top target. Let's give Lou a chance to work with Jones. Jones is our best chance to WIN.

Would the other guys mentioned really be better than Jones?

Dick

Jones has a rag arm and asked to be traded. Hendry is trying to accomodate him. Yes he put up decent offensive numbers last year, but no one wants a guy on their team that does not want to be there.

here is my wildcard prediction for CF...

Joey Gathright. Supposedly Gathright will be a reserve on the Royals next year with an already crowded OF in KC (Dejesus, Teahen, Brown, Sanders, & Gathright... and a top prospect named Billy Butler).

-He is young

-Left handed

-Has lights out speed.

-No power

-Piniella managed him in Tampa

Granted this guy hasn't put it all together yet in his young career but he has the tools and he could come cheep in a trade with the Royals.

just an idea.

I think that we could live with a primarily defensive CF with the lineup that we already have. Steve Finley could work. I know that he had a terrible year last year at the plate, but he's still a good defensive player. With the offense thats going to come from the 1-5 spots we could afford a light hitting CF. Rowand would also be a good choice, but I don't think that Hendry will be willing to give up too much like last year. Pie, undoubtibley will be great major leaguer. But he, only going to be 22 this year and I don't see any reason to rush the guy. I would prefer to keep Pagan on the bench. When he was healthy he seemed to do pretty well for a rookie in that position.

David,

Great point. I have said this too many times to count. There are quite a few fans that want players to start bc they "like" them or have a feeling about them, i.e. Cedeno, Theriot or Pagan. I get the impression that some don't care to look at their minor league careers to see what can be expected of these players in the majors. A guy like Cedeno batted .250 in the minors and bc he hit .300 in 80 at bats at the end of the 05' season, many fans were crowning him king. Sure enough, last year Cedeno hit .245. I feel confident Thierot would do the same thing this year had he started. I agree with Jason in the fact that bench players should remain on the bench, if only bc a team's bench needs to be strong.

As far as Jason's question on who I'd like to start CF and who will start, I really don't know. I was really hoping for Lofton. I guess I would like Wilkerson to play since he, prior to last year, had some good numbers and he's lefty.

I would love Aaron Rowand in CF but we still need to get him and I think that if he is available others will be in the hunt. Also he would be one more right handed bat. The thing I like about Pagan in CF he is so fast he should have no problem covering ground and he switch hits. The thing I don’t like about Pagan is that you don’t know what offence to expect from him. I can live with the lack of pop but not if he hits 250 bats 2nd and had a sub 300 OBP I like him for the 4th OF and off the bench until he can prove he should be an everyday player. And with Pagan you have to have a backup as he just might pull another hammie. I hope JH can put on the Trader Jim hat and get us someone good for CF I hope that trader Jim doesn’t bring home a bottle of Two Buck Chuck.

Great Article Jason. It seems to me that we are all pretty much in agreement that we're looking for a short term option in centerfield while Pie gets a little more seasoning. With the bats we currently have on the roster all we really need is a quality defensive centerfielder. What about Aaron Rowand? I think we'd be able to trade Philly Jones for Rowand and a prospect or two. Rowand is a gamer, that's going to play his heart out everyday. As long as he doesn't run face-first into the brick wall out there he could be a great option. Plus, what a nice dig that would be to all of the Sux fans out there. Think about it.

Soriano

Rowand

Lee

Ramirez

Barrett

Murton

Theriot/DeRosa

Izturis

P

That would be a great lineup while still fielding a great defensive unit at the same time. I haven't heard any rumors or anything, but man would that be nice. Just some food-for-though.

Jason, well written article.

On a another note, there are a few posters on this site that have compared Pagan to Beltran. I just looked up both of their minor league stats (at comparable ages) and there is nothing I see that would lead one to believe that Pagan has the same prospects that Beltran did. Pagan appears to be a speedster with no pop that is 25 and still has not secured a starting job in the majors ... while Beltran went 20/20 in the majors at age 22. Am I missing something? I like Pagan as a fourth OF, but I just don't see him as anything more.

I know he bats right, but what about Craig Wilson? I don't think the Yankees offered him a contract. Put him in LF, Soriano-CF, Murton-RF. Trade Jones for more pitching or for prospects. I know that means we are nothing but a righthanded offense, but for one year give it a try. He's got power and he played well when he was with the Pirates and he plays first base, too.